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    Rat u Ukrajini

    Notxor

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    Post by Notxor Sat Feb 19, 2022 7:08 pm

    E pa ako su tako rekli, red je da se NATO povuče nazad na zapad... ili VV Putin ima pravo da kaže pa da ne uradi da bude 1:1. /s

    u međuvremenu



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    Del Cap

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    Post by Del Cap Sat Feb 19, 2022 8:15 pm

    Olimpijski kalendar

    Rat u Ukrajini - Page 38 FL9jx9IX0AE_s4l?format=jpg&name=small
    Del Cap

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    Post by Del Cap Sat Feb 19, 2022 8:24 pm

    Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky, facing a sharp spike in violence in and around territory held by Russia-backed rebels and increasingly dire warnings that Russia plans to invade, on Saturday called for Russian President Vladimir Putin to meet him and seek resolution to the crisis.

    “I don't know what the president of the Russian Federation wants, so I am proposing a meeting,” Zelensky said at the Munich Security Conference, where he also met with US Vice President Kamala Harris. Zelensky said Russia could pick the location for the talks.

    “Ukraine will continue to follow only the diplomatic path for the sake of a peaceful settlement.”

    There was no immediate response from the Kremlin.
    rumbeando

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    Post by rumbeando Sat Feb 19, 2022 8:53 pm

    ​Lako može da se desi da zeznu Ukrajinu, ali da zato uteraju Finsku u Nato.
     
    Finland's president on Saturday compared Russia's current treatment of Ukraine to an attempt by Soviet dictator Josef Stalin to threaten and divide Finland before invading in 1939.
    "All what happens in Ukraine, all what happens in the Western world at the moment, reminds me of what happened in Finland," President Sauli Niinisto told a security conference in Munich.
    "Stalin thought that he will split the nation and it's easy to go and invade Finland. Totally the opposite happened. People united, and we see the same in Ukraine."
    Finland, part of the Russian empire from 1809 to 1917, resisted an initial Soviet invasion in 1939. The Nordic country later sided with Nazi Germany for much of World War Two and lost a chunk of its pre-war territory to the Soviet Union in peace treaties afterwards.
    During the Cold War, Finland was neutral between the West and the Soviet Union.
    https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/finland-likens-russias-treatment-ukraine-soviet-threats-2022-02-19/?taid=6211327bd2db8100016dce87&utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Content&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter
    Del Cap

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    Post by Del Cap Sat Feb 19, 2022 9:09 pm

    I tako, ukrajinski agent uhapšen u DNR za ruske medije otkriva planove Kijeva da jakom artiljerijskom vatrom udari po Donjecku.  Rat u Ukrajini - Page 38 3204619380

    Задержанный украинский агент раскрыл планы ВСУ по захвату Донбасса

    19 февраля 2022, 21:20

    Задержанный в Донецкой народной республике (ДНР) агент украинской разведки Антон Мацанюк рассказал о планах Киева силой захватить Донбасс. Об этом он сообщил 19 февраля Первому каналу.

    «Антон Мацанюк подтвердил: Киев намерен задействовать в силовом захвате Донбасса всю свою ударную мощь», — заявили в эфире канала.

    Как уточнил задержанный, вооруженные силы Украины намерены подвергнуть Донецк массированному артобстрелу.

    ...
    О задержании Мацанюка стало известно ранее в этот день. По данным журналистов, мужчина причастен к подрыву автомобиля начальника народной милиции ДНР Дениса Синенкова. При этом ранее Мацанюк сам работал в военном ведомстве.

    19 февраля СК РФ возбудил уголовное дело по факту подрыва машины начальника управления народной милиции ДНР Дениса Синенкова. В момент взрыва в автомобиле никого не было, начальник ведомства не пострадал.
    ...

    https://iz.ru/1294061/2022-02-19/zaderzhannyi-ukrainskii-agent-raskryl-plany-vsu-po-zakhvatu-donbassa
    Anonymous
    Guest

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    Post by Guest Sat Feb 19, 2022 9:23 pm

    dva dana se pitam ko puši ovu rusku propadandu i kako uopšte takav čovek može da samostalno veže pertle, a onda se prošetam po netu. "evo ima snimak, vidiš da evakuišu, zašto bi pokretne slike lagale, to je taj Francuz g. Luj Limijer napravio mašinu da snima stvarnost".
    kondo

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    Post by kondo Sat Feb 19, 2022 9:25 pm

    drugarica se odazvala, nema evakuacije diplomatskog osoblja iz ukrajine. 

    deca, kućni ljubimci, cveće da, zaposleni ne.


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    Дакле, волео бих да се ЈСД Партизан угаси, али не и да сви (или било који) гробар умре.
    Erős Pista

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    Post by Erős Pista Sat Feb 19, 2022 9:30 pm

    Cousin Billy wrote:dva dana se pitam ko puši ovu rusku propadandu i kako uopšte takav čovek može da samostalno veže pertle, a onda se prošetam po netu. "evo ima snimak, vidiš da evakuišu, zašto bi pokretne slike lagale, to je taj Francuz g. Luj Limijer napravio mašinu da snima stvarnost".

    Rat u Ukrajini - Page 38 3579118792


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    "Oni kroz mene gledaju u vas! Oni kroz njega gledaju u vas! Oni kroz vas gledaju u mene... i u sve nas."

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    Летећи Полип

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    Post by Летећи Полип Sat Feb 19, 2022 9:32 pm

    Rat u Ukrajini - Page 38 286371741 Rat u Ukrajini - Page 38 286371741 Rat u Ukrajini - Page 38 286371741


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    Sve čega ima na filmu, rekao sam, ima i na Zlatiboru.


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    Ne dajte da vas prevare! Sačuvajte svoje pojene!
    Del Cap

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    Post by Del Cap Sat Feb 19, 2022 9:33 pm

    Del Cap

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    Post by Del Cap Sat Feb 19, 2022 9:40 pm

    Rat u Ukrajini - Page 38 FL9bGzRXEAAu5Bw?format=jpg&name=small
    ficfiric

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    Post by ficfiric Sat Feb 19, 2022 9:41 pm

    I onaj Zarkovic kaze da nema evakuacije

    DIREKTNO iz DONBASA: Čujemo gruvanje artiljerije, naši uzvraćaju, slab odziv na evakuaciju! Zarković



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    Uprava napolje!

    Erős Pista

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    Post by Erős Pista Sat Feb 19, 2022 9:42 pm

    Slab odziv Rat u Ukrajini - Page 38 3579118792


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    "Oni kroz mene gledaju u vas! Oni kroz njega gledaju u vas! Oni kroz vas gledaju u mene... i u sve nas."

    Dragoslav Bokan, Novi putevi oftalmologije
    rumbeando

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    Post by rumbeando Sat Feb 19, 2022 9:48 pm

    Del Cap wrote:Rat u Ukrajini - Page 38 FL9bGzRXEAAu5Bw?format=jpg&name=small


    Dates of operation 14 October 1942 – 1949
    1949–1956 (localized)
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_Insurgent_Army

    Edit: takođe Ukrajinci nikad u zvaničnim dokumentima LNR i DNR ne nazivaju tako, već privremeno okupiranom teritorijom ili određenim delovima Donjecke i Luganske oblasti.


    Last edited by rumbeando on Sat Feb 19, 2022 10:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
    avatar

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    Post by Zus Sat Feb 19, 2022 10:10 pm

    Del Cap wrote:

    Tako je I Milosevic bio istoricar u predratnim razgovorima, ali on nije je imao s300, 400, 500.

    Kladio sam se sa drugarom da rata sirih razmera nece biti (mozda samo donbas, lugansk u izraelskom stilu 6 day war). Sad ne znam da li cu da dobijem opkladu, jer filerovani mozda nije samo ludi biznismen. Mozda je samo lud. Iako mislim da on sanja da uceni pola sveta za gas, naftu, psenicu I so (jebala ga so) kako nam ovaj domaci ludak rece danas.
    Sotir

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    Post by Sotir Sat Feb 19, 2022 10:17 pm

    Del Cap wrote:I tako, ukrajinski agent uhapšen u DNR za ruske medije otkriva planove Kijeva da jakom artiljerijskom vatrom udari po Donjecku.  Rat u Ukrajini - Page 38 3204619380

    У мору пропаганде, ово ипак не бих искључио као могућност. 
    Као агент можда му је један од задатака била корекција арт. ватре - да ли осматрањем или веб камерама.
    Mr.Pink

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    Post by Mr.Pink Sat Feb 19, 2022 10:20 pm

    Joj sto ste naporni sa tim pricama

    El moze play by play tema da ga drkamo


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    radikalni patrijarhalni feminista

    smrk kod dijane hrk
    Mr.Pink

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    Post by Mr.Pink Sat Feb 19, 2022 10:20 pm

    I za koga navijate


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    radikalni patrijarhalni feminista

    smrk kod dijane hrk
    Nektivni Ugnelj

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    Post by Nektivni Ugnelj Sat Feb 19, 2022 10:21 pm

    Zus wrote:
    Del Cap wrote:

    Tako je I Milosevic bio istoricar u predratnim razgovorima, ali on nije je imao s300, 400, 500.

    Kladio sam se sa drugarom da rata sirih razmera nece biti (mozda samo donbas, lugansk u izraelskom stilu 6 day war). Sad ne znam da li cu da dobijem opkladu,  jer filerovani mozda nije samo ludi biznismen. Mozda je samo lud. Iako mislim da on sanja da uceni pola sveta za gas, naftu, psenicu I so (jebala ga so) kako nam ovaj domaci ludak rece danas.

    To za sta ste se kladili realno ne zna niko. Mislim, kolikog ce tacno rata da bude.
    Del Cap

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    Post by Del Cap Sat Feb 19, 2022 10:29 pm

    Notxor

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    Post by Notxor Sat Feb 19, 2022 10:30 pm

    Ja sam totalno antiwar + optimista pa se nadam da nikakvog rata neće biti.


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    Del Cap

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    Post by Del Cap Sat Feb 19, 2022 10:45 pm

    Alexander Gabuev writes from Moscow on why Vladimir Putin and his entourage want war
    Elites have hijacked Russia and conflated the country's interests with their own

    Feb 19th 2022

    ANYWHERE YOU turn in Moscow, it's easy to find members of the Russian elite who wonder why the West thinks that war in Ukraine is the Kremlin’s preferred course of action. Even if the Russian army managed to force Kyiv into a swift and humiliating defeat without too many casualties, the damage to Russia’s national interests would surely outweigh any potential military gains.

    The problem is that the same logic was just as true eight years ago when the fateful decisions were made to annex Crimea and to stir conflict in Ukraine’s Donbas region. The fact that Russia has been able to endure the international fallout for all these years helps to explain why the region finds itself again on the brink of war.

    When it comes to Ukraine, people in Moscow and the West can be forgiven for assuming that the Kremlin’s policy is informed by a dispassionate strategy derived from endless hours of interagency debate and the weighing of pros and cons. What actually drives the Kremlin are the tough ideas and interests of a small group of longtime lieutenants to President Vladimir Putin, as well as those of the Russian leader himself. Emboldened by perceptions of the West’s terminal decline, no one in this group loses much sleep about the prospect of an open-ended confrontation with America and Europe. In fact, the core members of this group would all be among the main beneficiaries of a deeper schism.


    Consider Mr Putin’s war cabinet, which is the locus of most decision-making. It consists of Nikolai Patrushev, the head of the Security Council; Alexander Bortnikov, the head of the FSB (the main successor agency of the KGB intelligence service); Sergei Naryshkin, the head of Russian Foreign Intelligence Service; and Defence Minister Sergei Shoigu. Their average age is 68 years old and they have a lot in common. The collapse of the Soviet Union, which Mr Putin famously described as the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the 20th century, was the defining episode of their adult lives. Four out of five have a KGB background, with three, including the president himself, coming from the ranks of counterintelligence. It is these hardened men, not polished diplomats like Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov, who run the country’s foreign policy.

    In recent years members of this group have become very vocal. Messrs Patrushev and Naryshkin frequently give lengthy interviews articulating their views on global developments and Russia’s international role. According to them, the American-led order is in deep crisis thanks to the failure of Western democracy and internal conflicts spurred by the promotion of tolerance, multiculturalism and respect for the rights of minorities. A new multipolar order is taking shape that reflects an unstoppable shift in power to authoritarian regimes that support traditional values. A feisty, resurgent Russia is a pioneering force behind the arrival of this new order, along with a rising China. Given the state of affairs in western countries, the pair contend, it's only natural that they seek to contain Russia and to install pro-Western regimes in former Soviet republics. The West’s ultimate goal of a colour revolution in Russia itself would lead to the country’s conclusive collapse.

    Washington sees unfinished business in Russia’s persistence and success, according to Mr Putin’s entourage. As America’s power wanes, its methods are becoming more aggressive. This is why the West cannot be trusted. The best way to ensure the safety of Russia’s existing political regime and to advance its national interests is to keep America off balance.

    Seen this way, Ukraine is the central battleground of the struggle. The stakes could not be higher. Should Moscow allow that country to be fully absorbed into a western sphere of influence, Russia’s endurance as a great power will itself be under threat. On a personal level, the world view of the hard men is an odd amalgam of Soviet nostalgia, great-power chauvinism and the trappings of the Russian Orthodox faith. The fact that the new elite in Kyiv glorifies the Ukrainian nationalists of the 20th century and thumb their noses at Moscow is a huge personal affront.

    Why then are the people around Putin not scared about possible fallout from a new round of far-reaching economic sanctions? In their eyes, the sanctions that the West imposed to punish Russia for the annexation of Crimea and the war in Donbas were intended largely to check Russia’s rise. America and its allies would have found a way to introduce them one way or another, they were just looking for an excuse. Since 2014 such views have solidified. Messrs Patrushev, Bortnikov and Naryshkin all find themselves on the U.S. Treasury’s blacklist already, along with many other members of Mr Putin’s inner circle. There is no way back for them to the West’s creature comforts. They are destined to end their lives in Fortress Russia, with their assets and their relatives alongside them.

    As for sanctions by sector, including those that President Joe Biden’s team plans to impose should Russia invade Ukraine, these may end up largely strengthening the hard men’s grip on the national economy. Import substitution efforts have generated large flows of budget funds that are controlled by the coterie and their proxies, including through Rostec. The massive state conglomerate is run by a friend of Mr Putin’s from his KGB days in East Germany, Sergey Chemezov. In a similar vein, a ban on food imports from countries that have sanctioned Russia has led to spectacular growth in Russian agribusiness. The sector is overseen by Mr Patrushev’s elder son Dmitry, who is Mr Putin’s agriculture minister.

    Similarly much-touted financial sanctions have led to a bigger role for state-owned banks which, unsurprisingly enough, are also filled with KGB veterans. If anything, further sanctions wouldn’t just fail to hurt Mr Putin’s war cabinet, they would secure its members' place as the top beneficiaries of Russia’s deepening economic autarky. The same logic is true of domestic politics: as the country descends into a near-permanent state of siege, the security services will be the most important pillar of the regime. That further cements the hard men’s grip on the country.

    After two years of covid-induced self-isolation for Kremlin bosses, there is a clear tendency toward tunnel vision and a dearth of checks and balances. Russia’s interests are increasingly becoming conflated with the personal interests of the people at the very top of the system.



    Alexander Gabuev is a senior fellow and chair of the Russia in the Asia-Pacific Programme at the Carnegie Moscow Centre.
    Nektivni Ugnelj

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    Post by Nektivni Ugnelj Sat Feb 19, 2022 10:47 pm

    Notxor wrote:Ja sam totalno antiwar + optimista pa se nadam da nikakvog rata neće biti.

    Evo onda za tebe nesto 

    Nektivni Ugnelj

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    Post by Nektivni Ugnelj Sat Feb 19, 2022 10:48 pm

    Ja ne znam u ovoj situaciji sta moze da ponudi osim fakticki kapitulacije i da mu putin izdeklamuje novi ustav ukrajine.
    disident

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    Post by disident Sat Feb 19, 2022 10:49 pm

    Sotir wrote:
    disident wrote:Samo da ne padne na pcr testu ko sa Kosovom
    Rat u Ukrajini - Page 38 274349367_3122781211311933_4023302962102638187_n.jpg?_nc_cat=102&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=5cd70e&_nc_eui2=AeGdZox6IP-RzYHQUD-zmK9uGS4Nt0YtK1AZLg23Ri0rUNxdvtZGOTkbj1tL-oMXCRG4OZ2g-8EoT9mIqDYeJQfZ&_nc_ohc=1SzR74-p1wgAX8oib7U&_nc_ht=scontent.fbeg6-1

    Е кад Мор помене као у ЛНР/ДНР има још која десетина хиљада војника спремних за акцију, сетим се ликова као Бабај, Братислав Живковић, Деки снајпериста, они твоји гојазни изгубљени, Sgt Major Grizzly и остали знани и незнани, па нешто нисам сигуран да они имају неку борбену вредност у нападу уопште.
    Neonacista i ljotićevac iz Dnevnjaka otisao ove nedelje navodno

    Rat u Ukrajini - Page 38 Img_2122
    Rat u Ukrajini - Page 38 Img_2123


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