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    Rat u Ukrajini

    Notxor

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    Post by Notxor Fri Mar 18, 2022 10:48 pm

    Realno je najbolje sa svi na planeti govore kao kriptofašistički likovi iz filmova.

    Gospodine Zelenski/Putin šta je cilj vojnih operacija u ovom trenutku?

    “To crush your enemies. See them driven before you. And to hear the lamentations of their women.”


    _____
      Sweet and Tender Hooligan  
    boomer crook

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    Post by boomer crook Fri Mar 18, 2022 10:58 pm

    Filipenko wrote:
    Vilmos Tehenészfiú wrote:
    Ne razumes.

    Ako Putin kaze "nama svet u kome je ovakva Rusija (okruzena NATO) ne treba" kada zapreti nuklearkama, bio bi red da neko sa Zapada kaze "go ahead make my day". 

    Dok ne dobije takav odgovor, Putin nema razloga da promeni ponasanje.


    Da, taman posla da su mu dali da Ukrajina bude neutralna kada je to trazio, sledeci korak bi mu bile nuklearke, dobro je da su ga odjebavali na svakom koraku. Sada borci za mir poput tebe mogu mirne savesti da pozivaju na prag nuklearnog rata sa covekom za koga tvrde da je potpuno poludeo, jer ima li sta bolje nego izaci na crtu navodnom ludaku sa 6000 bojevih glava.

    kako da mu daju? on je to mogao da dogovori s ukrajinom jedno hiljadu puta do sada ali je morao i nesto da da. ovo je sada milosevicevizam: ako ne znamo da radimo i tome slicno.

    putin ne trazi neutralnost vec rusku polovinu sveta.


    _____
    And Will's father stood up, stuffed his pipe with tobacco, rummaged his pockets for matches, brought out a battered harmonica, a penknife, a cigarette lighter that wouldn't work, and a memo pad he had always meant to write some great thoughts down on but never got around to, and lined up these weapons for a pygmy war that could be lost before it even started
    Vilmos Tehenészfiú

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    Post by Vilmos Tehenészfiú Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:04 pm

    Filipenko wrote:
    Vilmos Tehenészfiú wrote:
    Ne razumes.

    Ako Putin kaze "nama svet u kome je ovakva Rusija (okruzena NATO) ne treba" kada zapreti nuklearkama, bio bi red da neko sa Zapada kaze "go ahead make my day". 

    Dok ne dobije takav odgovor, Putin nema razloga da promeni ponasanje.


    Da, taman posla da su mu dali da Ukrajina bude neutralna kada je to trazio, sledeci korak bi mu bile nuklearke, dobro je da su ga odjebavali na svakom koraku. Sada borci za mir poput tebe mogu mirne savesti da pozivaju na prag nuklearnog rata sa covekom za koga tvrde da je potpuno poludeo, jer ima li sta bolje nego izaci na crtu navodnom ludaku sa 6000 bojevih glava.
    Nije on “navodni ludak” nego glumi ludilo, i glumiće ga dok mu se to isplati, to jest dok mu neko ne odgovori na blef. 

    Niko nije hteo da se od strane Zapada saglasi da Ukrajina treba da bude neutralna dok se predsednik Ukrajine ne slozi sa tim. I sasvim je OK da nezavisna zemlja ima agendu koja je van želja bitnih medjunarodnih faktora. Ti to intuitivno razumes, i drago ti je sto je recimo Srbija van Nato jer to tako predsednik Srbije zeli - iako je Nato svugde oko Srbije. Ali iz nekog čudnog razloga smatraš da takav izbor za Ukrajince ne sme da postoji. Zašto?


    _____
    "Burundi je svakako sharmantno mesto cinika i knjiskih ljudi koji gledaju stvar sa svog olimpa od kartona."

    “Here he was then, cruising the deserts of Mexico in my Ford Torino with my wife and my credit cards and his black-tongued dog. He had a chow dog that went everywhere with him, to the post office and ball games, and now that red beast was making free with his lion feet on my Torino seats.”
    Vilmos Tehenészfiú

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    Post by Vilmos Tehenészfiú Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:05 pm

    Notxor wrote:Realno je najbolje sa svi na planeti govore kao kriptofašistički likovi iz filmova.

    Gospodine Zelenski/Putin šta je cilj vojnih operacija u ovom trenutku?

    “To crush your enemies. See them driven before you. And to hear the lamentations of their women.”
    Ovo je Borat, jel da?


    _____
    "Burundi je svakako sharmantno mesto cinika i knjiskih ljudi koji gledaju stvar sa svog olimpa od kartona."

    “Here he was then, cruising the deserts of Mexico in my Ford Torino with my wife and my credit cards and his black-tongued dog. He had a chow dog that went everywhere with him, to the post office and ball games, and now that red beast was making free with his lion feet on my Torino seats.”
    Nektivni Ugnelj

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    Post by Nektivni Ugnelj Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:06 pm

    Filipenko wrote:
    Vilmos Tehenészfiú wrote:
    Ne razumes.

    Ako Putin kaze "nama svet u kome je ovakva Rusija (okruzena NATO) ne treba" kada zapreti nuklearkama, bio bi red da neko sa Zapada kaze "go ahead make my day". 

    Dok ne dobije takav odgovor, Putin nema razloga da promeni ponasanje.


    Da, taman posla da su mu dali da Ukrajina bude neutralna kada je to trazio, sledeci korak bi mu bile nuklearke, dobro je da su ga odjebavali na svakom koraku. Sada borci za mir poput tebe mogu mirne savesti da pozivaju na prag nuklearnog rata sa covekom za koga tvrde da je potpuno poludeo, jer ima li sta bolje nego izaci na crtu navodnom ludaku sa 6000 bojevih glava.

    Videcemo jos da li je vojna neutralnost Ukrajine bila glavni pokretac ovog i onog rata 2014te
    Filipenko

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    Post by Filipenko Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:06 pm

    Jao da, zaboravih da je Ukrajina u vasoj viziji demokratija kojoj se niko ne mesa sa strane, a ne prcija kojoj americka ambasada i CIA odeljenja naoruzavaju koga hoce i naredjuju sta da radi.
    Nektivni Ugnelj

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    Post by Nektivni Ugnelj Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:08 pm

    Filipenko wrote:Jao da, zaboravih da je Ukrajina u vasoj viziji demokratija kojoj se niko ne mesa sa strane, a ne prcija kojoj americka ambasada i CIA odeljenja naoruzavaju koga hoce i naredjuju sta da radi.
     Ne to
    Gargamel

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    Post by Gargamel Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:10 pm

    Vilmos Tehenészfiú wrote:Ako pucas na Poljsku, saljemo ti balisticke rakete na polozaje vojske oko Ukrajine i sve opcije su na stolu, ukljucujuci bojne otrove i takticke nuklearke.
    https://wisdomofcrowds.live/the-ugly-truth-about-no-fly-zones/
    Tactical nuclear weapons should be distinguished from strategic nuclear weapons. The former are of much lower yield and destructive power than the latter, and are designed to obliterate a tank battalion or a base rather than an entire city. Indeed, they were first developed by the United States in the Cold War in order to deter superior Soviet land forces from contemplating an invasion of a comparatively overmatched NATO army on the European continent. The idea was that if the Soviets rolled tanks into the Fulda Gap, for example, NATO could destroy them without triggering the ultimate escalation to Mutually Assured Destruction—a nuclear exchange targeting cities on both sides that would likely end human civilization as we know it.
    ...
    Sadly, planners in Moscow were not as idealistic, or complacent. Willick cites a Congressional Research Service report, saying that "the United States has only 230 [tactical nuclear weapons], 'with around 100 deployed with aircraft in Europe.' Russia has up to 2,000." Talmadge nails down the predicament we find ourselves in: "The problem is that precisely because all-out nuclear war would be so costly for both the U.S. and Russia, Mr. Putin likely believes it won't happen. As a result, he may feel relatively safe engaging in conventional aggression or even limited nuclear use below that threshold—demonstration strikes, for example, or attacks on military targets—without much risk of a Western response."
    boomer crook

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    Post by boomer crook Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:12 pm

    moze da bude i prcija marsovaca ali to ne objasnjava ovaj rat s cisto cost-benefit aspekta. niti putinova prica o ukrajinskom bljesku/oluji ima smisla sa stanovista ove i ovakve operacije. ovo je jednostavno imperijalni grabez.


    _____
    And Will's father stood up, stuffed his pipe with tobacco, rummaged his pockets for matches, brought out a battered harmonica, a penknife, a cigarette lighter that wouldn't work, and a memo pad he had always meant to write some great thoughts down on but never got around to, and lined up these weapons for a pygmy war that could be lost before it even started
    Nektivni Ugnelj

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    Post by Nektivni Ugnelj Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:26 pm

    Gargamel wrote:
    Vilmos Tehenészfiú wrote:Ako pucas na Poljsku, saljemo ti balisticke rakete na polozaje vojske oko Ukrajine i sve opcije su na stolu, ukljucujuci bojne otrove i takticke nuklearke.
    https://wisdomofcrowds.live/the-ugly-truth-about-no-fly-zones/
    Tactical nuclear weapons should be distinguished from strategic nuclear weapons. The former are of much lower yield and destructive power than the latter, and are designed to obliterate a tank battalion or a base rather than an entire city. Indeed, they were first developed by the United States in the Cold War in order to deter superior Soviet land forces from contemplating an invasion of a comparatively overmatched NATO army on the European continent. The idea was that if the Soviets rolled tanks into the Fulda Gap, for example, NATO could destroy them without triggering the ultimate escalation to Mutually Assured Destruction—a nuclear exchange targeting cities on both sides that would likely end human civilization as we know it.
    ...
    Sadly, planners in Moscow were not as idealistic, or complacent. Willick cites a Congressional Research Service report, saying that "the United States has only 230 [tactical nuclear weapons], 'with around 100 deployed with aircraft in Europe.' Russia has up to 2,000." Talmadge nails down the predicament we find ourselves in: "The problem is that precisely because all-out nuclear war would be so costly for both the U.S. and Russia, Mr. Putin likely believes it won't happen. As a result, he may feel relatively safe engaging in conventional aggression or even limited nuclear use below that threshold—demonstration strikes, for example, or attacks on military targets—without much risk of a Western response."

    Da, s tim sto mi je malo nezamislivo da se dodje do po 200 ispaljenih taktickih nuklearki a da se ne trigeruju strateske.
    disident

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    Post by disident Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:27 pm

    Vilmos Tehenészfiú wrote:
    Filipenko wrote:


    Da, taman posla da su mu dali da Ukrajina bude neutralna kada je to trazio, sledeci korak bi mu bile nuklearke, dobro je da su ga odjebavali na svakom koraku. Sada borci za mir poput tebe mogu mirne savesti da pozivaju na prag nuklearnog rata sa covekom za koga tvrde da je potpuno poludeo, jer ima li sta bolje nego izaci na crtu navodnom ludaku sa 6000 bojevih glava.
    Nije on “navodni ludak” nego glumi ludilo, i glumiće ga dok mu se to isplati, to jest dok mu neko ne odgovori na blef. 

    Niko nije hteo da se od strane Zapada saglasi da Ukrajina treba da bude neutralna dok se predsednik Ukrajine ne slozi sa tim. I sasvim je OK da nezavisna zemlja ima agendu koja je van želja bitnih medjunarodnih faktora. Ti to intuitivno razumes, i drago ti je sto je recimo Srbija van Nato jer to tako predsednik Srbije zeli - iako je Nato svugde oko Srbije. Ali iz nekog čudnog razloga smatraš da takav izbor za Ukrajince ne sme da postoji. Zašto?


    Nemoj brate rodjeni, tako je i pre invazije pisano ovde da ce mu propasti blef tj gomilanje snaga pa vidimo sta je iz toga ispalo


    _____
    Što se ostaloga tiče, smatram da Zapad treba razoriti
    Jedini proleter Burundija
    Pristalica krvne osvete
    boomer crook

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    Post by boomer crook Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:29 pm

    ahem ja sam pisao da ce napasti mada nisam ocekivao ovakvo zaglibljavanje


    _____
    And Will's father stood up, stuffed his pipe with tobacco, rummaged his pockets for matches, brought out a battered harmonica, a penknife, a cigarette lighter that wouldn't work, and a memo pad he had always meant to write some great thoughts down on but never got around to, and lined up these weapons for a pygmy war that could be lost before it even started
    Anonymous
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    Post by Guest Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:31 pm

    Ja sam pisao da neće biti baš ničega!
    Јанош Винету

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    Post by Јанош Винету Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:42 pm

    boomer crook wrote:moze da bude i prcija marsovaca ali to ne objasnjava ovaj rat s cisto cost-benefit aspekta. niti putinova prica o ukrajinskom bljesku/oluji ima smisla sa stanovista ove i ovakve operacije. ovo je jednostavno imperijalni grabez.
    +1
    Али то се тек сада види. 

    После ових слетова у подршци Путину и његових говора. 
    Путин је добро проценио, али не Украјинце него своје. Воле тај империјализам. А Украјинце ко шиша, њихову вољу, жеље, аспирације. Све то иде под гусенице тенкова.


    _____
    Burundi is an exception among other nations because it is a country which gave God first place, a God who guards and protects from all misfortune.
    Burundi... opskurno udruženje 20ak levičarskih intelektualaca, kojima je fetiš odbrana poniženih i uvredjenih.
    Notxor

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    Post by Notxor Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:43 pm

    Vilmos Tehenészfiú wrote:
    Notxor wrote:Realno je najbolje sa svi na planeti govore kao kriptofašistički likovi iz filmova.

    Gospodine Zelenski/Putin šta je cilj vojnih operacija u ovom trenutku?

    “To crush your enemies. See them driven before you. And to hear the lamentations of their women.”
    Ovo je Borat, jel da?

    Konan the varvarin


    _____
      Sweet and Tender Hooligan  
    Mr.Pink

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    Post by Mr.Pink Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:43 pm

    Izdelice ko u dobra vremena na istok i zapad zemlju, samo je pitanje koko mrtvih i stvari ce ae desiti do tad


    _____
    radikalni patrijarhalni feminista

    smrk kod dijane hrk
    Јанош Винету

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    Post by Јанош Винету Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:44 pm

    Мислим да он сада има амбиције да то анектира у потпуности, да припоји Русији. Мада, ко зна, можда му игра и нека Источна Украјина.


    _____
    Burundi is an exception among other nations because it is a country which gave God first place, a God who guards and protects from all misfortune.
    Burundi... opskurno udruženje 20ak levičarskih intelektualaca, kojima je fetiš odbrana poniženih i uvredjenih.
    Mr.Pink

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    Post by Mr.Pink Fri Mar 18, 2022 11:45 pm

    Ova armija juzna od milicija nabrijana

    A rusi sto posto stekaju neka cuda. Pa evo sad provalilo da im iskander rakrte imaju 3-4 tipa mamaca znaci ne moz ga oboris

    Ne bi patkometriso sa rusima oko raketa
    Vilmos Tehenészfiú

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    Post by Vilmos Tehenészfiú Sat Mar 19, 2022 12:27 am

    disident wrote:
    Vilmos Tehenészfiú wrote:
    Nije on “navodni ludak” nego glumi ludilo, i glumiće ga dok mu se to isplati, to jest dok mu neko ne odgovori na blef. 

    Niko nije hteo da se od strane Zapada saglasi da Ukrajina treba da bude neutralna dok se predsednik Ukrajine ne slozi sa tim. I sasvim je OK da nezavisna zemlja ima agendu koja je van želja bitnih medjunarodnih faktora. Ti to intuitivno razumes, i drago ti je sto je recimo Srbija van Nato jer to tako predsednik Srbije zeli - iako je Nato svugde oko Srbije. Ali iz nekog čudnog razloga smatraš da takav izbor za Ukrajince ne sme da postoji. Zašto?


    Nemoj brate rodjeni, tako je i pre invazije pisano ovde da ce mu propasti blef tj gomilanje snaga pa vidimo sta je iz toga ispalo
    Gde ovde? Amerika je stalno pričala da će do invazije doći, čak su skoro i u dan pogodili.

    Nego aj da zajebemo ovo sa nuklearkama, mene zanima kako su znali kada je navodno samo 5-6 ljudi oko Putina znalo sve? Ko je medju njima špijun Cije?


    _____
    "Burundi je svakako sharmantno mesto cinika i knjiskih ljudi koji gledaju stvar sa svog olimpa od kartona."

    “Here he was then, cruising the deserts of Mexico in my Ford Torino with my wife and my credit cards and his black-tongued dog. He had a chow dog that went everywhere with him, to the post office and ball games, and now that red beast was making free with his lion feet on my Torino seats.”
    Gargamel

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    Post by Gargamel Sat Mar 19, 2022 12:28 am

    Mór Thököly wrote:Da, s tim sto mi je malo nezamislivo da se dodje do po 200 ispaljenih taktickih nuklearki a da se ne trigeruju strateske.
    u konvencionalnom ratu, očito da Rusi nemaju šta da traže kontra NATO-а.

    pa je poenta citiranog u tome da, ne samo da bi Rusi imali motiv da u nekakvom sukobu eskaliraju upotrebom nekonvencionalnih sredstava, već bi imali i dominaciju u eventualnoj eskalaciji.


    Last edited by Gargamel on Sat Mar 19, 2022 12:30 am; edited 1 time in total
    Vilmos Tehenészfiú

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    Post by Vilmos Tehenészfiú Sat Mar 19, 2022 12:29 am

    Јанош Винету wrote:
    boomer crook wrote:moze da bude i prcija marsovaca ali to ne objasnjava ovaj rat s cisto cost-benefit aspekta. niti putinova prica o ukrajinskom bljesku/oluji ima smisla sa stanovista ove i ovakve operacije. ovo je jednostavno imperijalni grabez.
    +1
    Али то се тек сада види. 

    После ових слетова у подршци Путину и његових говора. 
    Путин је добро проценио, али не Украјинце него своје. Воле тај империјализам. А Украјинце ко шиша, њихову вољу, жеље, аспирације. Све то иде под гусенице тенкова.
    Ih, vole imperijalizam. Ko ga ne voli, osim Dalaj Lame?


    _____
    "Burundi je svakako sharmantno mesto cinika i knjiskih ljudi koji gledaju stvar sa svog olimpa od kartona."

    “Here he was then, cruising the deserts of Mexico in my Ford Torino with my wife and my credit cards and his black-tongued dog. He had a chow dog that went everywhere with him, to the post office and ball games, and now that red beast was making free with his lion feet on my Torino seats.”
    Јанош Винету

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    Post by Јанош Винету Sat Mar 19, 2022 12:32 am

    Vilmos Tehenészfiú wrote:
    disident wrote:


    Nemoj brate rodjeni, tako je i pre invazije pisano ovde da ce mu propasti blef tj gomilanje snaga pa vidimo sta je iz toga ispalo
    Gde ovde? Amerika je stalno pričala da će do invazije doći, čak su skoro i u dan pogodili.

    Nego aj da zajebemo ovo sa nuklearkama, mene zanima kako su znali kada je navodno samo 5-6 ljudi oko Putina znalo sve? Ko je medju njima špijun Cije?

    Знали су и Украјинци, качио сам на овој теми. Зато тако Русима килаво иде.

    Све су предвидели, где шта и како, само нису имали снаге да се одупру како треба баш на 4 места у исто време.


    _____
    Burundi is an exception among other nations because it is a country which gave God first place, a God who guards and protects from all misfortune.
    Burundi... opskurno udruženje 20ak levičarskih intelektualaca, kojima je fetiš odbrana poniženih i uvredjenih.
    rumbeando

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    Post by rumbeando Sat Mar 19, 2022 12:38 am

    Will Vernon @BBCWillVernon
    8h • 6 tweets • 2 min read
    This is the picture the Kremlin wants you to see: thousands of people who support President Putin and the "special military operation" in Ukraine, crammed into Luzhniki Stadium in Moscow. We went there today and talked to dozens of people who attended... 🧵
    Many said they worked in the public sector (e.g. schoolteachers), and that they had been pressured into attending by their employers. One group of teachers, from a town near Moscow, were being told what to say to us by a woman who appeared to be from the local administration.
    One man, who works in the Moscow metro, told us that he and other employees had been forced to attend the rally. "I'll be here for a while and then I'll leave… I think most people here don't support the war. I don't," he said.
    In comparison to opposition rallies, most people didn't want to talk, be filmed or answer any questions. Some would cover their faces or put up their hoods when we said we are journalists. Many seemed embarrassed or ashamed to be there.
    Students told us they had been given the option of a day off from lectures if they attended 'a concert.' Some of them didn't even know that the event was dedicated, in part, to support for Russian forces in Ukraine.
    There were doubtless some people in attendance who genuinely support President Putin and the "special military operation in Ukraine", as the Kremlin prefers to call it.
    https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1504839545921093648.html
    Nektivni Ugnelj

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    Post by Nektivni Ugnelj Sat Mar 19, 2022 12:40 am

    Gargamel wrote:
    Mór Thököly wrote:Da, s tim sto mi je malo nezamislivo da se dodje do po 200 ispaljenih taktickih nuklearki a da se ne trigeruju strateske.
    u konvencionalnom ratu, očito da Rusi nemaju šta da traže kontra NATO-а.

    pa je poenta citiranog u tome da, ne samo da bi Rusi imali motiv da u nekakvom sukobu eskaliraju upotrebom nekonvencionalnih sredstava, već bi imali i dominaciju u eventualnoj eskalaciji.

    Jasno, ali u praksi ta eskalacija ne moze da ide ni do 200, a kamoli do 2000.
    rumbeando

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