USA - США - SAD

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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Blind Lime Pie on Thu Jul 20, 2017 6:29 pm

prošla baba sa uštipcima sistemom po meri čoveka.


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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Hubert de Montmirail on Thu Jul 20, 2017 6:43 pm

možda 2020, ali opet sumnjam


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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by паће on Thu Jul 20, 2017 7:29 pm

Демократску странку да преотму или да на рушевинама праве нову. Ако смисле нешто треће, свака им дала.


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чим кажу да бројке не лажу, тачно знам да баш онда лажу
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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by William Murderface on Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:37 am

The Millennials are the American Earthquake

This is a super-fascinating article for multiple reasons.
First, it turns out millennials are even more like the 1930s generation than we realized. Not just in their politics, as Andrew Hartman recently argued, but also in their economic practices. Having come of age during an epic financial crisis, they’re now staying away from the stock market, and putting their money in savings accounts—the equivalent, during the Depression, of stuffing your dollar bills in a mattress for fear of there being a run on the banks.
These little gestures signal deep cultural shifts that are ultimately really important for politics. My generation was raised to think that the stock market was our savior. Fuck pensions and Social Security! You can’t trust the state or the long-term future. You can get much better returns from the whiz kids on Wall Street. That millennials are rejecting that kind of message seems hugely significant to me.
I’ve been saying for years that I would love to see a contemporary version of Edmund Wilson do what he did during the Depression: go and report on the everyday life of the Financial Crisis and its aftermath, seeing how the mood and manner of this generation has been fundamentally altered and reshaped by that experience. It may not be quite The American Earthquake—yet—but there certainly are tremors (what Wilson called, in the book’s first iteration, “the American jitters.”)
Second, that the Post thinks millennials earning $40,000 a year have tons of extra disposal income to sock away for their futures seems risible. Given rents and job precarity and student loans that have to be paid off, it seems totally rational to me that a young person in today’s economy would want to be assured that they’ll have money for food and rent come next month. Better to keep it in the bank than tie it up in a long-term index fund or whatever. Having the money near at hand seems perfectly understandable.
Third, the freakout from the Post and the investor class over this is delicious. Wall Street has ever been the antenna of the nation. It registers —inadvertently, unconsciously—movements and shifts that aren’t always apparent to the eye. Not just economic movements but also cultural and political ones. As Jevons said:
Just as we measure gravity by its effects in the motion of a pendulum, so we may estimate the equality or inequality of feelings by the decisions of the human mind. The will is our pendulum, and its oscillations are minutely registered in the price lists of the markets.
What the market is telling us is: the motion of the pendulum is moving in a different direction, the will of this new generation is not like that of its recent predecessors.
Update (9:45 am)
Just a few minutes out, and I’m already seeing tons of responses to this on Twitter and Facebook. Young people telling their personal stories—with precision, concreteness, detail—of their struggles in this economy. I find it all unbelievably poignant.
It just makes me all the more enraged at the Clinonite blather you hear on social media. And not just the Clintonites; it’s also the left. What in the end do we on the left have to offer people today? Medicare for All and free college. Don’t get me wrong; these would be great, and I’ve been fighting for them, too. But they don’t touch the fundamentals of the economy. I don’t mean that in a Marxist sense.
Just think of everyone from the New Dealers to Bill Clinton: all of them had a theory of the economy and how it might improve people’s lives and standing. Clinton’s was bullshit, but he was the last one to even think he had to offer a comprehensive account to people. Perhaps that was due to the hangover from the Cold War, which is now over. Without the challenge of communism, we don’t think we need to give people something like a vision of the economy.
So we let this generation die. We bury them, without having even the decency to perform an autopsy or deliver a eulogy.

http://coreyrobin.com/2017/07/23/the-millennials-are-the-american-earthquake/


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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by William Murderface on Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:39 am

The Democrats: A party that wants to die but can’t pull the plug

Yesterday, I noted my exasperation, in the face of the economic desperation of the younger generation, with the Clintonites in the Democratic Party. Young men and women are drowning in massive debt, high rent, low pay, and precarious jobs, and what do the Democrats have to offer them?
In today’s Times, Chuck Schumer, the highest elected official in the Democratic Party, gave an answer:
Right now millions of unemployed or underemployed people, particularly those without a college degree, could be brought back into the labor force or retrained to secure full-time, higher-paying work. We propose giving employers, particularly small businesses, a large tax credit to train workers for unfilled jobs. This will have particular resonance in smaller cities and rural areas, which have experienced an exodus of young people who aren’t trained for the jobs in those areas.
Tax credits to employers to train unskilled workers.
Do you know how old and ancient and bullshit this idea is? Here’s how old and ancient and bullshit this idea is. When, more than a decade ago, the University of Oregon political scientist Gordon Lafer came out with his landmark study The Job Training Charade, demonstrating how poorly these job training programs had performed over the years, he reached back, on the cover of the book, to a 1982 bill that essentially promised to do what Schumer is now proposing to do.

There’s one difference. Where the 1982 bill focused on government programs and partnerships, Schumer’s bill seems to focus exclusively on tax giveaways to employers, already awash in cash.
Why did Lafer feature that bill on his cover? Because despite decades of data and research showing how bad these programs were, they held an unusual attraction to Republican and Democratic legislators alike. Co-sponsors of that 1982 bill ranged from right-wingers like Paula Hawkins and Thad Cochran (remember them?) and Orrin Hatch to liberals like Teddy Kennedy. Job training, Lafer showed in exhaustive detail, has come to be the neoliberal salve for our free-market age. When you can’t do anything else for workers, train them. For jobs that aren’t there or wages that suck.
It’s true that Schumer offers other proposals, including a $15 minimum wage, but for anyone with a memory, the devotion of one sentence, much less a paragraph, of precious column space to this synecdoche of the bipartisan political economy of the last four decades—well, it’s enough to make you think this is a party that wants to die but can’t pull the plug.




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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Gargantua on Tue Jul 25, 2017 10:58 pm

Obamacare repeal jumps first Senate hurdle

Obamacare repeal effort clears early hurdle in US Senate vote

by: Barney Jopson in Washington


The Republican effort to overhaul Obamacare took a critical step forward on Tuesday as senators opened the way for a make-or-break vote on scrapping Barack Obama’s healthcare reforms.

Republicans breathed a sigh of relief after 50 of their 52 senators helped them over a crucial hurdle, voting to begin debate on competing plans to repeal Obamacare after six months of struggling to fulfil a campaign pledge by Donald Trump.

But the entire Senate was also upbraided by Senator McCain, who returned to vote having recently been diagnosed with brain cancer and decried partisan bickering and so far unacceptable proposals to reform healthcare.

The outcome of the revived legislative process remains highly uncertain. Mitch McConnell, the Senate majority leader, is taking a risk by allowing for a healthcare bill to be revised by potentially dozens of amendments during debate on the Senate floor.

Mr McCain said: “We Republicans have looked for a way to end [Obamacare] and replace it with something else without paying a terrible political price. We haven’t found it yet, and I’m not sure we will.

“All we’ve managed to do is make more popular a policy that wasn’t very popular when we started trying to get rid of it.”

With Democrats united in their opposition to undoing Obamacare, Mr McCain helped lock the chamber in a 50-50 tie and Mike Pence, vice-president, stepped in to break the deadlock in Republicans’ favour.

Mr Trump had sought to raise the pressure on Republican senators in recent days. After the vote he lashed out at two moderate Republicans — Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski — who voted against opening debate.

“We had two Republicans that went against us, which is very sad, I think. It is very, very sad for them,” Mr Trump said at a White House press conference.

The two moderate senators are worried about people losing health insurance and form part of a larger group that may yet stand in the way of reform legislation.

The start of the vote was interrupted by protesters in the Senate gallery who launched into a resounding chant of “Kill the bill, don’t kill us”.

Doubts remain over whether Mr Trump’s party can coalesce around any plan to repeal and replace Obamacare, or to repeal it first then replace it later.

The party has been riven by disagreements between conservatives who want to cut back the role of government and moderates.

Mr Trump said: “I believe now we will over the next week or two we will come up with a plan that is going to be really, really wonderful for the American people.”

Chuck Schumer, the top Senate Democrat, called the Republican strategy to allow multiple amendments to a healthcare bill a “ruse”. “No one knows the plan that is being cooked up in the Republican leader’s office,” he said.

kud ne crče maverik na vreme....
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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Filipenko on Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:06 pm

Mekejn će i iz groba ubijati ljude masovno.
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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by William Murderface on Wed Jul 26, 2017 1:31 am

Gargantua wrote:
Obamacare repeal jumps first Senate hurdle

Obamacare repeal effort clears early hurdle in US Senate vote

by: Barney Jopson in Washington


The Republican effort to overhaul Obamacare took a critical step forward on Tuesday as senators opened the way for a make-or-break vote on scrapping Barack Obama’s healthcare reforms.

Republicans breathed a sigh of relief after 50 of their 52 senators helped them over a crucial hurdle, voting to begin debate on competing plans to repeal Obamacare after six months of struggling to fulfil a campaign pledge by Donald Trump.

But the entire Senate was also upbraided by Senator McCain, who returned to vote having recently been diagnosed with brain cancer and decried partisan bickering and so far unacceptable proposals to reform healthcare.

The outcome of the revived legislative process remains highly uncertain. Mitch McConnell, the Senate majority leader, is taking a risk by allowing for a healthcare bill to be revised by potentially dozens of amendments during debate on the Senate floor.

Mr McCain said: “We Republicans have looked for a way to end [Obamacare] and replace it with something else without paying a terrible political price. We haven’t found it yet, and I’m not sure we will.

“All we’ve managed to do is make more popular a policy that wasn’t very popular when we started trying to get rid of it.”

With Democrats united in their opposition to undoing Obamacare, Mr McCain helped lock the chamber in a 50-50 tie and Mike Pence, vice-president, stepped in to break the deadlock in Republicans’ favour.

Mr Trump had sought to raise the pressure on Republican senators in recent days. After the vote he lashed out at two moderate Republicans — Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski — who voted against opening debate.

“We had two Republicans that went against us, which is very sad, I think. It is very, very sad for them,” Mr Trump said at a White House press conference.

The two moderate senators are worried about people losing health insurance and form part of a larger group that may yet stand in the way of reform legislation.

The start of the vote was interrupted by protesters in the Senate gallery who launched into a resounding chant of “Kill the bill, don’t kill us”.

Doubts remain over whether Mr Trump’s party can coalesce around any plan to repeal and replace Obamacare, or to repeal it first then replace it later.

The party has been riven by disagreements between conservatives who want to cut back the role of government and moderates.

Mr Trump said: “I believe now we will over the next week or two we will come up with a plan that is going to be really, really wonderful for the American people.”

Chuck Schumer, the top Senate Democrat, called the Republican strategy to allow multiple amendments to a healthcare bill a “ruse”. “No one knows the plan that is being cooked up in the Republican leader’s office,” he said.

kud ne crče maverik na vreme....

+1

Gad. Gad.


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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by zvezda je zivot on Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:17 am

covek kome su pre par dana izvadili mozak ima pravo glasa lol uvek se iznanedim sta je sve moguce u americi


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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by William Murderface on Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:22 am

Tramp je realno najsimpaticniji lik u toj septickoj jami koja se naziva GOP. Nije ni cudo da je pobedio. Samo je on i mogao da pobedi.


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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by zvezda je zivot on Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:30 am

mozemo da mislimo sta hocemo o mekejnu, ali on bar ima uverenja (ili kako on kaze filozofiju) i spreman je da se zrtvuje za njih, to moras da cenis. tramp je rijeliti klovn koji ni u sta ne veruje, nema ideologiju i bruka ameriku u svetu.


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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by William Murderface on Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:40 am



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"Oni kroz mene gledaju u vas! Oni kroz njega gledaju u vas! Oni kroz vas gledaju u mene... i u sve nas."

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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by zvezda je zivot on Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:06 am

ja stvarno ne verujem da bi berni bio prijatelj s nekim ko je los kao covek.

Ben Jacobs‏Verified account @Bencjacobs
The Senate chamber broke out into laughter as the vote ended when a Bernie Sanders/John McCain hug turned into something resembling a waltz




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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Filipenko on Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:41 pm

SŠA uvela divljačke sanckije naspram Rusije, čeka se odgovor EU i svih Rusiji partnerskih kompanija. Nadam se da neće poštedeti nijednu nemačku firmu. Možda Tramp uloži veto, ali mu džaba, jer je ogromna većina ratnih zločinaca, odnosno kongresmena i senatora, usvojila zakon, pa može da override-uje veto.

Inače, potpuno sam fasciniran bahatošću. Ovo je bukvalno nabijanje sankcija svakom konkurentu američkog izvoza tečnog gasa koji je unapred propao biznis o kome se puno govori i govorilo se, pa sad valjda ne smeju da objave svima da je to propalo. Bukvalno, ali bukvalno kao kada je Rim Kartagini zabranio da proizvodi masline.
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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Gargantua on Wed Jul 26, 2017 5:37 pm

pozdravljam zavrtanje rusko-nemačko-austrijskih i ostalih ušiju, konačno neki red da se zna
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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Gargantua on Wed Jul 26, 2017 8:40 pm

da okačim ovde jer je tema tu:



Compromise Impossible: What the Sanctions Bill against Russia Means?

July 25, 2017
Ivan Timofeev


The toughening of the American position after Hamburg puts Russia at a disadvantage. It will either have to punch fist on the table, or, in the worst kind, pretend that nothing terrible happened and continue to search for compromises and solutions, not paying attention to the increasing pressure. At the same time, further intensification of pressure against Russia is almost inevitable. This is caused by a number of factors.

First, the pressure on Russia can and will go through numerous channels, bypassing the US president, even if we take for granted the fact that he would like to normalize relations with Russia. Trump himself may well use the Russian card to fight his opponents inside the US, periodically exacerbating conflict, as it happened with a missile attack in Syria. It is also important that the anti-Russian campaign in the United States is already living its own life and has become a chronic factor that will prevail over diplomats.

Second, the situation in Ukraine and especially in Syria remains extremely fragile and vulnerable to provocations. There are no reasons that could induce the Americans to change their position on the Ukrainian issue. Here we can observe further radicalization of the American position in case of another round of clashes. To provoke them, as recent experience shows, is very easy. It is far from obvious that communication with the new US special representative for Ukraine will solve the problems, especially given his "hawkish" position. The situation in Syria is even more unstable, where the number of players capable of destabilizing the situation is much greater.

Third, the modernization of the US armed forces and the growth of defense spending will intensify the tension in bilateral relations. Today, there are no serious grounds for Washington to change its position on spending increase. The modernization of nuclear arsenals will be particularly sensitive. In this area, one must be prepared for unpleasant surprises, like the further degradation of the INF Treaty.

Fourth, there is the survivability of the "authoritarian Russia" narrative and the positioning of Russia as a counterparty with dubious legitimacy. Trump diligently avoids bringing up the subject, for the time being. But its presence in the American discourse is only increasing.

Finally, fifth, the anti-Russian policy of the United States is close to get a comprehensive legislative framework. Voting in the House of Representatives on anti-Russian sanctions is an important step along this path. The adoption of the bill will determine the US policy towards Russia for decades to come. And this will be a policy of strangling Russia. The bill is notable for the following components.

First of all, Russia is not the only subject of the bill. The document also provides sanctions against Iran and North Korea, as well as actions to counter terrorism. In other words, the bill places Russia in the line of "rogue states", as well as together with issues comparable to terrorism. This cuts the ground out from under the feet of those who hoped to minimize the damage from sanctions and preserve the Russian-American cooperation within the framework of the "five on Iran" and "six on Korea". In Moscow it is now quite natural to ask the question: what is the point of cooperation with Washington on these issues, if we are equated with the same problems?

The next important point:  the bill includes a wide range of "misconducts" for which Russia should be punished. Here are Ukraine, Syria, cyber space, medium and short range missiles, interference in elections, propaganda, corruption, human rights, and energy policy. This means that any steps towards Washington or attempts to compromise on certain issues are doomed to failure in advance. The bill devalues diplomacy in Russian-American relations, making meaningless any initiatives to resolve the accumulated problems. Why should Moscow negotiate with the United States and its allies on Syria or Ukraine if they can always get the human rights out of their pockets, or democracy, motivating them to keep sanctions and hostile policies in general? Such an approach makes any theoretical compromises on the part of Russia a game in one gate.

Further. The bill twists the hands of any country of the world, which plans to cooperate with Russia. This is mainly about energy, although sanctions are also implied in a number of other sectors - railway transport, mining, defense, etc. One can understand the indignation of the European allies of the United States, which are Russia's key trading partners. It is interesting that the bill directly spells out the goal of the American companies to enter the energy market of Europe by ousting Russia from it. The EU taxpayers will have to pay for this. But more importantly, sanctions can be applied against any country, including, by the way, the members of the EAEU and any other country that is more or less friendly towards Russia. [što ne i Srbija?]

It is interesting that the bill also presupposes a very strict reporting system. Practically in all directions the Congress will have to receive regular reports from the executive branch. Such reports should, for example, include information on Russian businessmen and the extent of their relationship with the Russian government. This means that any more or less big Russian businessman should be kept under surveillance and contracts with the state, for example, can become a matter for sanctions. Their introduction is left for the executive. The administration can look at this or that "violation" through fingers, but at the same time it receives a tool for pressure and manipulation.

Finally, the verification of many provisions remains extremely vague and fuzzy. Especially that many of the claims of the American side are still unproven. This negates any hopes for any constructive discussion.

In the final analysis, sanctions leave Russia the only alternative — to accept the US as a strategic and key challenge to its security. And if earlier such a position could be disputed, now it is receiving the most serious legitimacy by the hands of the congressmen. The irony is that sanctions threaten not only Russia's security, but also the security of the US itself. The power and capabilities of Russia cannot be overestimated. But they should hardly be underestimated. And if earlier diplomats had a wide maneuver for cooperation where both sides benefited, now the space for such a maneuver is reliably concreted at the legislative level.

For the sake of justice, it should be noted that the bill provides a softening of positions in the event that corresponds to the vital interests of the United States. The big question is whether Moscow cooperates if Washington has really vital problems.


Author: Ivan Timofeev is Programme Director of the Valdai Discussion Club, Director of Programs at Russian International Affairs Council (RIAC).

http://russiancouncil.ru/en/analytics-and-comments/analytics/compromise-impossible-what-the-sanctions-bill-against-russia-means/
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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Filipenko on Wed Jul 26, 2017 11:07 pm

Toliki tekst, a nigde ono glavno: sankcije služe da promovišu poslovne interese energetskog lobija SŠA i da sabotiraju energetske projekte koji nisu pod direktnom CIA kontrolom.

No, Babašvabine bube imaju dobre vesti za evropske vrednosti:


Шефер: Убедили смо Американце да у санкције против Русије унесу важне измене





       ЕВРОПСКА унија је успела да убеди САД да у закон о новим санкцијама против Русије унесу „низ важних измена“ - изјавио је портпарол немачке дипломатије Мартин Шефер.

       Притом је навео: „Током протекле четири недеље, влада Немачке и Европска комисија предочавали су Вашингтону своју аргументацију. Текст који је изгласан у Представничком дому знатно је побољшан у односу на оно што смо имали прилику да видимо раније“.

       Шефер није открио детаље, али је нагласио да је Вашингтону било предочено да нико нема право да „иза завесе санкција реализује своју индустријску политику. На овоме ћемо и даље инсистирати“.

       Више европских компанија критиковало је нове америчке санкције. Са поруком: „Руски гас је потребан Европи“.

       Помињање гаса није случајно. Вашингтон на све начине покушава да спречи градњу гасовода Северни ток-2.


Ovo postaje tragikomično, a u neku ruku mi je drago što će proamerička politika Putina da doživi totalni i potpuni fijasko i ostati u amanet svima koji budu pretendovali na njegovo mesto. Sa Jenkijima nema razgovora. Samo pesnica u zube, onda može razgovor. Sa Švabama nema razgovora. Samo motkom po glavi, pa onda da im se ošamućenima drži bukvica.

Sve što su radili se ispostavilo uzaludnim i, na kraju balade, daleko štetnijim i sa više posledica nego da su odmah uradili ono što je trebalo - brza vojna intervencija u Ukrajini radi zaštite demokratije i tekovina krhkog parlamentarizma, oštro i beskompromisno razračunavanje sa pobunjenicima na terenu, podrška prijateljski naklonjenoj vlasti u Kijevu koja bi uključivala i dozvolu novostvorenim oblastima ili celini Ukrajine da postane član Ruske Federacije, prekid svih gasnih aranžmana sa EU radi usklađivanja sa direktivama EU, što bi naložilo da se zarad načela energetske bezbednosti i ravnomernog razvoja EU mora puštati ista količina gasa (približno trećina) kroz Severni tok, preko Ukrajine i kroz Južni tok, i da prve isporuke kreću čim EU obezbedi infrastrukturne preduslove za ravnomeran razvoj - čitaj, kada izgradi gasovode. Na Babašvabine vapaje odgovoriti pesmom Cuneta Gojkovića "Kafu mi, draga, ispeci!".

Ovako, dobili su kurac tvrd, zajedno sa Krimom da slave dolazak pustinjske sekte iz doline Jordana u svoje krajeve.
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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Gargantua on Thu Jul 27, 2017 8:57 am

BERLIN (Reuters) - New sanctions against Russia being proposed by United States lawmakers could harm German companies and add another difficulty to Berlin's relationship with Washington, Germany economy minister Brigitte Zypries said on Thursday.
"The U.S. has left the common line it had with Europe for sanctions against Russia," Zypries told ARD television, adding that by not coordinating with Europe on the matter, there was a risk that German companies would be harmed.
German business leaders warn that new sanctions passed last week by the U.S. House of Representatives could prevent German companies from working on pipeline projects that they say are essential to Germany's energy security.




BRUSSELS (Reuters) - The European Union warned on Wednesday that it was ready to act within days to counter proposed new U.S. sanctions on Russia, saying they would harm the bloc's energy security.
Sanctions legislation overwhelmingly approved by the U.S. House of Representatives on Tuesday has angered EU officials: they see it as breaking transatlantic unity in the West's response to Moscow's annexation of Crimea from Ukraine in 2014 and its support for separatists in eastern Ukraine.
Brussels also fears the new sanctions will harm European firms with connections to Russia, and oil and gas projects on which the EU is dependent.
"The U.S. bill could have unintended unilateral effects that impact the EU's energy security interests," EU chief executive Jean-Claude Juncker said in a statement issued after a meeting at which European commissioners were united in their views, according to a senior EU official.
"If our concerns are not taken into account sufficiently, we stand ready to act appropriately within a matter of days. 'America First' cannot mean that Europe's interests come last," he said, mentioning President Donald Trump's guiding slogan.

A EU document prepared for the commissioners, seen by Reuters, laid out the EU's plans to seek "demonstrable reassurances" that the White House would not use the bill to target EU interests.
The bloc, it says, will also prepare to use an EU regulation allowing it to defend companies against the application of extraterritorial measures by the United States.
If diplomacy fails, Brussels plans to file a complaint at the World Trade Organization. "In addition, the preparation of a substantive response that would deter the U.S. from taking measures against EU companies could be considered," it says.
However, most measures taken by Brussels would require approval from all 28 EU member governments, which could expose potential differences in individual nations' relations with Moscow and Washington.

Despite changes to the U.S. bill that took into account some EU concerns, Brussels said the legislation could still hinder upkeep of the gas pipeline network in Russia that feeds into Ukraine and supplies over a quarter of EU needs. The EU says it could also hamper projects crucial to its energy diversification goals, such as the Baltic Liquefied Natural Gas (LNG) project.
The new sanctions target the disputed Nord Stream 2 project for a new pipeline running from Russia to Germany under the Baltic Sea. But the EU note says: "the impact would in reality be much wider."
A list prepared by the EU executive, seen by Reuters, shows eight projects including those involving oil majors Anglo-Dutch Shell, BP and Italy's Eni that risk falling foul of the U.S. measures.
Voicing frustration at the fraying in the joint Western approach to Moscow, Juncker said "close coordination among allies" was key to ensuring that curbs on business with the Russian energy, defence and financial sectors, imposed in July 2014, are effective.

EU sources said Juncker told Commissioners the risk to EU interests was collateral damage of a U.S. domestic fight between Trump and U.S. lawmakers.
It was unclear how quickly the U.S. bill would reach the White House for Trump to sign into law or veto. The bill amounts to a rebuke of Trump by requiring him to obtain lawmakers' permission before easing any sanctions on Moscow.
Rejecting the legislation - which would potentially stymie his wish for improved relations with Moscow - would carry a risk that his veto could be overridden by lawmakers.

Industry Concerns


European energy industry sources voiced alarm at the potentially wide-ranging damage of the new U.S. measures.
"This is pretty tough," one industry source told Reuters. "We are working with EU officials to see what safeguards can be anticipated to protect our investment and give us certainty."
Five Western firms are partnered with Russia's Gazprom in Nord Stream 2: German's Wintershall [WINT.UL] and Uniper, Anglo-Dutch Royal Dutch Shell, Austria's OMV and France's Engie.
But EU officials warn the U.S. measures would also hit plans for the LNG plant on the Gulf of Finland in which Shell is partnering with Gazprom.
The EU document shows they might jeopardise Eni's 50 percent stake in the Blue Stream pipeline from Russia to Turkey as well as the CPC pipeline, carrying Kazakh oil to the Black Sea, involving European groups BG Overseas Holdings, Shell and Eni .
It further warns that BP would be forced to halt some activities with Russian energy major Rosneft.



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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Zuper on Thu Jul 27, 2017 9:03 am

Sankcije koje su predlozene nisu nesto posebno opasne za Rusiju vise gadjaju Trampa i EU/UK. Ali ono sto mogu da donesu u buducnosti moze biti opasno za Rusiju.
Ovo su targetirane sankcije za Severni tok 2 i  pogadjaju Britance kao i Nemce jer BP i Sel su izuzetno vazni u tom projektu.
Juce se pojavila vest, koja nije potvrdjena, da je sud u Londonu nalozio da Ukrajina plati $3 milijarde Rusiji duga. Ako je vest tacna, ne vidim nista drugo nego kao britanski odgovor zbog moguceg sankcionisanja BP i Sela.
Koliko znam, Rusi su za Seveni tok 2 nasli finansije u Kini ako evropsljani odustanu zbog prtiiska SAD.
Uzgred, bilo bi posteno da Nemci plate za Severni tok-2 dodatno jer su rusili Juzni tok da bi onda lepo radili na Severnom toku.

Problem je sto nove mere podrazumevaju moguce sankcionisanje ruskog dzavnog duga i raznih derivata u buducnosti. E, to je skoro objava rata. To nije ukljuceno sada ali je ostavljeno kao mogucnost za buducnost.

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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Zuper on Thu Jul 27, 2017 9:08 am

A, da, u sankcionisane projekte nisu samo ukljuceni Rusi vec i Kazaci a mislim i Azeri za Juzni koridor  sto je anti-ruski gasni projekat  Dakle, bukvalno pokusavaju da narede EU/UK da samo kupuju njihov gas, toliko o slobodnom trzistu. Cak kriza u Kataru mi sada izgleda kao pokusaj blokiranja izvoza LNG iz Katara, koji je najveci izvoznik LNG, da bi SAD kompanije preuzele njihovo trziste.
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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Filipenko on Thu Jul 27, 2017 9:12 am

Pa da, uključeno je sve što nije pod direktnom kontrolom Cije. Niko ne sme da konkuriše njihovom skupom tečnom gasu, ko se usudi najebaće.
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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Filipenko on Thu Jul 27, 2017 9:13 am

...a nije da nema leka za jenkijevske zgadije...



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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Gargantua on Thu Jul 27, 2017 5:15 pm

Zuper wrote:A, da, u sankcionisane projekte nisu samo ukljuceni Rusi vec i Kazaci a mislim i Azeri za Juzni koridor  sto je anti-ruski gasni projekat  Dakle, bukvalno pokusavaju da narede EU/UK da samo kupuju njihov gas, toliko o slobodnom trzistu. Cak kriza u Kataru mi sada izgleda kao pokusaj blokiranja izvoza LNG iz Katara, koji je najveci izvoznik LNG, da bi SAD kompanije preuzele njihovo trziste.

kakav njihov gas, ne mogu da pokriju ni deo ruskih isporuka sve da nacede iz onih škriljaca. rusi pokrivaju 38-39, norveška 34-35, ameri možda 1% i to načelno imaju samo skuplji gas. ovo je tema za američki gas samo delimično, ovo je pre svega interno ludovanje kongresa koji se pegla sa trampom i daje oduška fajtu sa rusijom.
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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Gargantua on Thu Jul 27, 2017 5:20 pm

sankciju gađaju ciljano saradnju sa rusijom u poslovima izvozne izgradnje gasovoda. po onome kako su sad postavljene, predsedniku je dato odobrenje da može da kazni* i recimo srbiju ako pruža usluge (bilo kakve, vrednije od 1M$) ruskoj firmi koja negde pravi gasovod, recimo na teritoriji srbije. južni tok bi bio 1/1 meta sankcija.

* sankcije podrazumevaju blokiranje finansijskih transakcija, nemogućnost zaduživanja na američkom tržištu (npr američki fondovi ne bi mogli da kupuju srpske hov), američka blokada međunarodnih finansijskih insititucija prema tim subjektima itsl.

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Re: USA - США - SAD

Post by Zuper on Thu Jul 27, 2017 5:45 pm

Vecina izvoznih terminala koji se grade ulaze u upotrebu 2017-2020.
Gas jeste skuplji i nije konkurentan ruskom gasu kroz gasovode, i ne samo ruskom, zato se ovo i radi.

Re: USA - США - SAD

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