EU - what's next?

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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Gargantua on Sun Dec 24, 2017 12:33 am

jel vas dojmilo što su kurc i štrahe koaliciju formirali na kalenbergu, ne slučajno?
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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by William Murderface on Sun Dec 24, 2017 12:36 am

Kalenberski zavet.


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Gargantua on Sun Dec 24, 2017 12:37 am

falili samo krilati husari da razbiju neki migrantski kamp


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by William Murderface on Sun Dec 24, 2017 12:46 am

beatakeshi wrote:Proterati u prapostojbinu, zarad čistote Evropejstva.


Jebeni Azijati, realno.

Sto jd najludje, azijatsko poreklo se bas potencira u madjarskom nacionalizmu. Istina, vise u Jobbik, manje u Fidesz varijanti. Ma raspad mozga.

Bonus: 
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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by disident on Sun Dec 24, 2017 12:48 am

Kakva je situaacija sa formiranjem vlade u nemackoj? dobio sam jedan sulud info koji se bavi desetom oblascu,ali da proverim pozdanost


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Mr.Pink on Sun Dec 24, 2017 12:55 am

pa madjari to rade od srednjega veka. msm, atila madjar, sahranili ga negde ispod dunava čiji su tok pomerili...samo su se nadovezali na to, mrtva klasika.


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Kondo on Sun Dec 24, 2017 1:20 am

Gargantua wrote:falili samo krilati husari da razbiju neki migrantski kamp

tesko to ide sa afganima, utrenirano to od fajta sa svima. ovde samo zandarmi sa fudbala izlaze na kraj sa njima ako bude stani pani.


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Anduril on Sun Dec 24, 2017 1:20 am

Zanimljiva situacija ce tek nastati kada krenu pregovori za novi EU budzet - tu bi se mogli naci neka ozbiljnija iznenadjenja za Visegradsku grupu. 
No, glavni problem je sto VG moze da koristi EU nesposobnost oko migranata kao argument da pokrije svoje klizanje u orbanizam.
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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Hubert de Montmirail on Sun Dec 24, 2017 4:40 pm

EU se suče na hridi. Trenutno ideologija Festung Europe ima jasne zagovornike unutar EU a vrlo verovatno će se Višehradu uskoro pridružiti i Austrija.


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Kondo on Sun Dec 24, 2017 4:50 pm

Neka idu, neće se vratiti!


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Filipenko on Sun Dec 24, 2017 5:09 pm

Kada cujem termin "Visegradska grupa", odmah se vatam za katanac od kaveza sa mrkim medvedima


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Gargantua on Sun Dec 24, 2017 5:16 pm

...

Thinking longer-term, multi-speed Europe may well solve not only the uneven willingness of states to move toward closer cooperation, but may also provide the perfect opportunity to leave behind states that are unwilling to fully adhere to basic principles. If the EU proves unable to rein in autocrats any other way, the incorporation of conditionality techniques into policing each of the integration’s concentric circles is likely to become a necessary element of the edifice. As the speed and vectors of integration evolve, Poland and the likes of Poland could find themselves outside the scope of meaningful activity – behind the door of the integration’s kitchen. With the growing pressure on the Union’s values from a number of countries, this may be the most realistic way forward to preserve the EU as a union of value in the long run, while also being sufficiently open towards the states hijacked by autocratic and plutocratic forces.

http://verfassungsblog.de/the-european-commissions-activation-of-article-7-better-late-than-never/


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Filipenko on Sun Dec 24, 2017 5:33 pm

Nadam se da je svima jasno da je Evropa u vise brzina kraj Evropske Unije. Naravno, nece to uslediti odmah, ali ce se prosto krenuti u gomilu disonantnih procesa koje vise nista nece moci da zaustavi. Ako grupa zemalja ima neke privilegije a ja nemam onda ne moram ni da postujem neka pravila tih zemalja niti one mogu da me prinude da postujem ta a i neka druga, te mogu da se druzim i sa drugima, taj fazon. Zapravo, to je institucionalizovanje kraja EU. Naravno, ocekujem da magarac koji izadje sa time bude Makron.
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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Kondo on Sun Dec 24, 2017 5:40 pm

ja bi to sve izbacio napolje a primio nas


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by KinderLad on Sun Dec 24, 2017 6:08 pm

Kondo wrote:ja bi to sve izbacio napolje a primio nas

+1
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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by паће on Sun Dec 24, 2017 6:12 pm

Kondo wrote:ja bi to sve izbacio napolje a primio nas

Јес и мени их жао да се мрцваре и тако полако крваре годинама. Ми бисмо их разјебали рекордном брзином, мање би патили.


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Santino on Sun Dec 24, 2017 6:19 pm

William Murderface wrote:
beatakeshi wrote:Proterati u prapostojbinu, zarad čistote Evropejstva.


Jebeni Azijati, realno.

Sto jd najludje, azijatsko poreklo se bas potencira u madjarskom nacionalizmu. Istina, vise u Jobbik, manje u Fidesz varijanti. Ma raspad mozga.

sta je tu ludo? i sta je azija, samo geografska odrednica, uz to proizvoljno odredjena (ural). evropa je evropska kultura, a po ovim fasistima tu se dodaje bela rasa i hriscanstvo. nista tu nije kontradiktorno, samo je cisto zlo.


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by паће on Sun Dec 24, 2017 6:56 pm

Шта фали Азијатима? Нпр Јеврејима?


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by otto katz on Sun Dec 24, 2017 7:40 pm

Volio bih da Višegrad okupiraju Rusi i njime vladaju narednih 200 godina. Češku naravno ne, ona će se u posljednji trenutak prikloniti Zapadu. Ali Poljake i Madžare hehe. A u Češkoj kao zemlji prve linije fronte Švabo da zavede vojnu upravu, Reichsstadt Prag.


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Anduril on Mon Dec 25, 2017 1:52 am

Gargantua wrote:
...

Thinking longer-term, multi-speed Europe may well solve not only the uneven willingness of states to move toward closer cooperation, but may also provide the perfect opportunity to leave behind states that are unwilling to fully adhere to basic principles. If the EU proves unable to rein in autocrats any other way, the incorporation of conditionality techniques into policing each of the integration’s concentric circles is likely to become a necessary element of the edifice. As the speed and vectors of integration evolve, Poland and the likes of Poland could find themselves outside the scope of meaningful activity – behind the door of the integration’s kitchen. With the growing pressure on the Union’s values from a number of countries, this may be the most realistic way forward to preserve the EU as a union of value in the long run, while also being sufficiently open towards the states hijacked by autocratic and plutocratic forces.

http://verfassungsblog.de/the-european-commissions-activation-of-article-7-better-late-than-never/

Ovo je kljuc ali naravno nece resiti problem u sledecih 6 meseci. Medjutim, pregovori oko novog budzeta od 2020-27 pocinju i tu mogu da zamislim sta se desava iza scene. Ako zaista planiraju multispid Europe to ce se sigurno odraziti na taj budzet i njegovu raspodelu. Poljska recimo dobija skoro 80 milijardi iz tekuceg budzeta a Madjarska je ekonomski isto tako zavisna - pitanje je samo vremena kada ce politicki pritisak prerasti u ekonomski. Postoji i vojna dimenzija posto moze da se desi da se Poljska i drustvo nadju u tampon zoni izvan vojne integracije Evrozone.

Zanimljiv je i ovaj deo, tj. da postoji mogucnost pritiska kroz nepriznavanje sudova:
The explanation might lie beyond the simple difficulty of the procedural requirements related to the sanctioning stage. Even though Article 7(1) is merely a warning without any direct sanctions, the indirect effects of triggering Article 7(1) should not be underestimated. To name but a few possible knock-on effects (further analysis and references here), the activation of Article 7(1) coupled with the forthcoming total subjugation of the Polish courts to the whims and interests of the Polish ruling party may lead the Court of Justice to set aside the principle of mutual trust and/or stop recognising Polish courts as courts within the meaning of EU Law (the ongoing and arguably insufficiently noticed infringement procedure concerning the Polish Law on the Ordinary Courts will require the Court of Justice to address, for the first time as far as we know, the independence of the whole judiciary of a Member State). This could then leave the European Commission no choice but to suspend EU funding to Poland, an option which according to Israel Butler is in any event already available to the Commission (on this issue see also a recent report ‘Can EU funds promote the rule of law in Europe?’).
A functioning judicial system is not only necessary to maintain a constitutional government; it is also necessary to maintain a market economy. The impact on commercial arbitration involving Polish companies if not the financial markets may also in time be too significant to be comfortably ignored by Polish authorities. And while it was recently noted by Capital Economics that the experience of Hungary suggests that ‘recurrent run-ins’ with the EU ‘do not tend to have much impact on growth in the short-run’, ‘the potential impact on Poland’s growth prospects over the medium-term’ might eventually become significant for an economy which is not only highly dependent on EU funding but also FDI.
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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Kondo on Mon Dec 25, 2017 2:16 am

otto katz wrote:Volio bih da Višegrad okupiraju Rusi i njime vladaju narednih 200 godina. Češku naravno ne, ona će se u posljednji trenutak prikloniti Zapadu. Ali Poljake i Madžare hehe. A u Češkoj kao zemlji prve linije fronte Švabo da zavede vojnu upravu, Reichsstadt Prag.

now you're talking


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by disident on Mon Dec 25, 2017 2:39 am



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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Zuper on Mon Dec 25, 2017 2:46 am

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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by паће on Mon Dec 25, 2017 7:56 am

Anduril wrote: Postoji i vojna dimenzija posto moze da se desi da se Poljska i drustvo nadju u tampon zoni izvan vojne integracije Evrozone.

Тампон су већ једном били, само се женска мења.


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Re: EU - what's next?

Post by Gargantua on Mon Dec 25, 2017 8:14 am

Vojna integracija - kako god slabašna bila - će se odvijati kroz pesco a tu su praktično sve zemlje EU i formalno uključene. Sad, sadržaj pescoa može biti različit ali to ionako nije niti će biti alternativa NATOu.

Pored toga, once you go multi-speed you never go back. Takva EU prosto neće biti EU, i čitav niz političkih kalkukacija će se menjati, to ne može biti jasan i razložan ishod nego ishod sa x nepoznatih.


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Re: EU - what's next?

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