"Niska" književnost

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William Murderface

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"Niska" književnost

Post by William Murderface on Thu Oct 30, 2014 11:23 am

Kako se odnosimo prema, u nedostatku boljeg imena, "niskoj" književnosti? Ako volimo, zašto volimo? Da li je uopšte smatramo niskom, ili ne? Šta očekujemo od nje? Kako gledamo na trošenje vremena na nju? Da li smatramo da je bolje čitati nisku književnost nego ništa? Zašto?

Kao uvod u temu, Parksov tekst, Reading Upward.


Reading Upward
Tim Parks


From the Collections of the Museum of the City of New York
Arnold Eagle: Boys Climbing the Fire Escape of a Deserted Building, 1935

“Frankly, I don’t mind what they’re reading, Twilight, Harry Potter, whatever. So long as they are reading something there’s at least a chance that one day they’ll move on to something better.”

How many times have we heard this opinion expressed? On this occasion the speaker was a literary critic on Canadian radio with whom I was discussing my recent blog post “Reading: The Struggle.” Needless to say the sentiment comes along with the regret that people are reading less and less these days and the notion of a hierarchy of writing with the likes of Joyce and Nabokov at the top and Fifty Shades of Grey at the bottom. Between the two it is assumed that there is a kind of neo-Platonic stairway, such that from the bottom one can pass by stages to the top, a sort of optimistic inversion of the lament that soft porn will lead you to hard and anyone smoking marijuana is irredeemably destined to descend through coke and crack to heroin. The user, that is, is always drawn to a more intense form of the same species of experience.

Of course, while the fear that one will descend from soft to hard drugs tends to be treated as a near certainty, the hope that one might ascend from Hermione Granger to Clarissa Dalloway is usually expressed as a tentative wish. Nevertheless, it serves to justify the intellectual’s saying, “Frankly, I don’t mind what they’re reading, etc.” (as if this were some kind of concession), and underwrites our cautious optimism when we see an adolescent son or daughter immersed in George R.R. Martin. It’s not Dostoevsky, but one day it might be, and in any event it’s better than a computer game or TV since these are not part of the reading stairway.

Is any of this borne out by reality? Do people really pass from Fifty Shades of Grey to Alice Munro? (Through how many intermediate steps? Never to return?) And if it is not true why does a certain kind of intellectual continue to express them? To what end?

In 1948 W.H. Auden published an essay, “The Guilty Vicarage,” on what he calls his “addiction” to detective novels. The point he makes is that these schematic narratives serve the escapist needs of readers who share his particular psychological make-up. These people will not, as a rule, Auden claims, with some elaborate argument, be the same readers as readers of light romances or thrillers, or fantasy fiction. Each genre has its pull on different types of minds. In any event, if he, Auden, is to get any serious work done, he has to make sure that there are no detective novels around, since if there are he can’t resist opening them, and if he opens them he won’t close them till he’s reached the end. Or rather, no new detective novels; for Auden notes this difference between the stuff of his addiction and literature: that the detective novel is no sooner read than forgotten and never invites a second reading, as literature often does.

The implications are clear enough. Auden denies any continuity between literary novels and genre novels, or indeed between the different genres. One does not pass from lower to higher. On the contrary one might perfectly well fall from the higher to the lower, or simply read both, as many people eat both good food and junk food, the only problem being that the latter can be addictive; by constantly repeating the same gratifying formula (the litmus test of genre fiction) it stimulates and satisfies a craving for endless sameness, to the point that the reader can well end up spending all the time he has available for reading with exactly the same fare. (My one powerful experience of this was a spell reading Simenon’s Maigret novels; after five or six it gets harder and harder to distinguish one from another, and yet one goes on.)

Auden, it should be noted, does not propose to stop reading detective novels—he continues to enjoy them—and expresses no regret that people read detective novels rather than, say, Faulkner or Charlotte Brontë, nor any wish that they use detective novels as a stepping stone to “higher things.” He simply notes that he has to struggle to control his addiction, presumably because he doesn’t want to remain trapped in a repetitive pattern of experience that allows no growth and takes him nowhere. His essay, in fact, reads like the reasoning of someone determined to explain to himself why he must not waste too much time with detective novels, and at the same time to forgive himself for the time he does spend with them. If anything, genre fiction prevents engagement with literary fiction, rather than vice versa, partly because of the time it occupies, but more subtly because while the latter is of its nature exploratory and potentially unsettling the former encourages the reader to stay in a comfort zone.

I’m forced to pause here to admit the objection that much supposedly literary fiction also repeats weary formulas, while some novels marketed as genre fiction move toward the exploratory by denying readers the sameness the format led them to expect. And of course many literary writers have made hay “subverting” genre forms. However, if the “I-don’t-mind-people-reading-Twilight-because-it could-lead-to-higher-things” platitude continues to be trotted out, it is because despite all the blurring that has occurred over recent years, we still have no trouble recognizing the difference between the repetitive formula offering easy pleasure and the more strenuous attempt to engage with the world in new ways.

So do people pass from the genre to the literary up our neo-Platonic ladder? Do they discover Stieg Larsson and move on to Pamuk? With no studies or statistics available to settle the question—at least I have not come across any—I can only resort to anecdotal evidence, as a father of three and a university teacher for many years. And the first thing to say is that no one has ever spoken to me of making this progression. My children all enjoyed listening to the classic canon of children’s stories in their infancy, but this did not automatically lead to “serious reading” later on, despite, or quite possibly because of, their parents’ highly developed reading habit. My son spent his adolescence switching back and forth between computer games and compulsive rereadings of The Lord of the Rings, equally happy with both forms of entertainment. Later, he gathered together complete collections of Jo Nesbø and Henning Mankell. When I have suggested trying the work of certain novelists I like—Coetzee, Moravia—his complaint is invariably that they are too disturbing and too close to home. My eldest daughter oscillates between pulp fiction and literary fiction with the greatest of ease, perfectly aware of the entirely different pleasures they offer. My youngest daughter pursues vast fantasy chronicles and seems entirely happy with them; they have never prompted her to consider opening any of the more literary works our bookshelves are stacked with. In fact she reads fantasy chronicles because they are not to be found on the family bookshelves and offer a distinctly different experience from literary fiction. She does not want, she says, to be troubled with the kind of realities she sees quite enough of. She likes the costumed world of bold exploits and special powers.

When I speak to my students, what is most striking is that the majority of them, who are content on a diet made up exclusively of genre fiction, simply do not perceive any difference in kind between these and literary works; they do not see the essentially conservative nature of the one and the exploratory nature of the other. They register no need to widen their reading experiences. Often they propose theses on genre works of no distinction whatsoever, unable to understand why their teachers might put these in a different category from, say, Doris Lessing or D.H. Lawrence.

If we assume, then, for the sake of argument and in the absence of persuasive information to the contrary, that narratives do not form a continuum such that one is naturally led from the simpler to the more complex, but offer quite different experiences that mesh with readers’ psyches and requirements in quite different ways, why do the right-thinking intellectuals continue to insist on this idea, even encouraging their children to read anything rather than nothing, as if the very act of reading was itself a virtue?

It’s evident that publishers have a commercial interest in the comforting notion that any reading is better than none. They can feel virtuous selling a hundred million copies of Fifty Shades, strong in the hope that at least some of those folks might move on to Pulitzer and Nobel winners, and perhaps eventually to some of the more obscure and adventurous writers in their stables — just as, in Fifty Shades itself, the heroine Anastasia can indulge in a little S&M as part of a project to lead Christian Grey out of his perversion and on to the joys of the missionary position in conventional wedlock. It’s always a relief to have reasons for supposing that what one is doing might have a bit more to it than the merest self-interest.

At a deeper level, there is a desire to believe in an educational process that puts the intellectual in a pastoral relationship to an ingenuous public who must be coaxed in a positive direction; that is, the notion of this pathway upward from pulp to Proust allows for the figure of the benign educator who takes the hands of blinkered readers and leads them from the stable to the stars, as the Italians say. It’s good to posit a scheme of things in which possibly obsolete skills like close reading and critical analysis in fact have an important social role.

What no one wants to accept—and no doubt there is an element of class prejudice at work here too—is that there are many ways to live a full, responsible, and even wise life that do not pass through reading literary fiction. And that consequently those of us who do pursue this habit, who feel that it enriches and illuminates us, are not in possession of an essential tool for self-realization or the key to protecting civilization from decadence and collapse. We are just a bunch of folks who for reasons of history and social conditioning have been blessed with a wonderful pursuit. Others may or may not be enticed toward it, but I seriously doubt if E.L. James is the first step toward Shakespeare. Better to start with Romeo and Juliet.
August 11, 2014, 2:55 p.m.


_____
"Oni kroz mene gledaju u vas! Oni kroz njega gledaju u vas! Oni kroz vas gledaju u mene... i u sve nas."

Dragoslav Bokan, Novi putevi oftalmologije
Ferenz

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by Ferenz on Thu Oct 30, 2014 2:23 pm

Čitam "nisku" književnost.
Nisam baš uvek u fazonu da stremim ka "beskrajnom plavom krugu i u njemu zvezdi".

Doduše, neću čitati autobiografiju Alena Slavice koja je objavljena i u nas, ali kanda ima interesenata za nj.

William Murderface

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by William Murderface on Thu Oct 30, 2014 2:24 pm



Znao sam da će svi da čitaju "niška".



_____
"Oni kroz mene gledaju u vas! Oni kroz njega gledaju u vas! Oni kroz vas gledaju u mene... i u sve nas."

Dragoslav Bokan, Novi putevi oftalmologije
Ferenz

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by Ferenz on Thu Oct 30, 2014 2:27 pm

Kako ne bi..Deksa, Ćira, Karanović..Dončić.
A evo, i Slavica ima promociju u Niš.
William Murderface

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by William Murderface on Thu Oct 30, 2014 2:41 pm

Ko je Slavica?


_____
"Oni kroz mene gledaju u vas! Oni kroz njega gledaju u vas! Oni kroz vas gledaju u mene... i u sve nas."

Dragoslav Bokan, Novi putevi oftalmologije
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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by Guest on Thu Oct 30, 2014 3:18 pm

Jel to Alen daosamtidususrcesamtidaooooooo i luduluduludujem?









bruno sulak

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by bruno sulak on Thu Oct 30, 2014 3:23 pm

citam nisku knjizevnost rado. mada mislim da je prilicno nejasno sta je tacno cini. da li su legvinova i tolikin 'niska' knjizevnost?

takodje svi koji citaju ipak cesto, sto kaze jedan od junaka reverteovog kluba dumas, imaju zajednicku prapostojbinu koju nastanjuju atos, milejdi, d'artanjan i portos.


_____
The law provides us structure to guide us through paralyzing and trying times. But it requires us a vision to its procedures and higher purposes. Before we assume our respective roles in this enduring drama just let me say that when these frail shadows we inhabit now have quit the stage we'll meet and raise a glass again together in Valhalla.
William Murderface

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by William Murderface on Thu Oct 30, 2014 3:23 pm

Jao Alen Slavica

Ja se mislim ko je sad ta Slavica, mora da je neka od ovih spisateljica sa dva prezimena..


_____
"Oni kroz mene gledaju u vas! Oni kroz njega gledaju u vas! Oni kroz vas gledaju u mene... i u sve nas."

Dragoslav Bokan, Novi putevi oftalmologije
William Murderface

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by William Murderface on Thu Oct 30, 2014 3:35 pm

timur chevket wrote:citam nisku knjizevnost rado. mada mislim da je prilicno nejasno sta je tacno cini. da li su legvinova i tolikin 'niska' knjizevnost?

takodje svi koji citaju ipak cesto, sto kaze jedan od junaka reverteovog kluba dumas, imaju zajednicku prapostojbinu koju nastanjuju atos, milejdi, d'artanjan i portos.

To je dobro pitanje, i mislim da nije nikakav problem prihvatiti da postoji velika siva zona, te da je granica obostrano propustljiva. Ali ipak, što reče Parks, jasno je da neke primere prepoznajemo bez problema - 50 Shades of Grey je "niska" književnost (a ne samo slaba, što verovatno takođe jeste).





_____
"Oni kroz mene gledaju u vas! Oni kroz njega gledaju u vas! Oni kroz vas gledaju u mene... i u sve nas."

Dragoslav Bokan, Novi putevi oftalmologije
bruno sulak

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by bruno sulak on Thu Oct 30, 2014 3:41 pm

pa chabon je napisao da su ga posmatrali ko ludaka kada je poceo da pise i serijski objavljuje gentlemen of the road ali im je on odgovorio da je vec ispunio svoju kvotu mid-life male intellectual divorce crisis romana pa moze da pise i sword & sandals ako mu se cefne.


Last edited by timur chevket on Thu Oct 30, 2014 4:58 pm; edited 1 time in total
William Murderface

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by William Murderface on Thu Oct 30, 2014 3:57 pm

Da, imao je Šejbon i onaj dobar tekst u NYRB baš o toj zajedničkoj prapostojbini, mislim da sam već kačio na tamou, ali evo i ovde.

Ipak moram da primetim da se taj odgovor lepo uklapa upravo u ovu odnovsku shemu - odradio sam ozbiljan deo, sad mogu da se prepustim čistoj zabavi.


_____
"Oni kroz mene gledaju u vas! Oni kroz njega gledaju u vas! Oni kroz vas gledaju u mene... i u sve nas."

Dragoslav Bokan, Novi putevi oftalmologije
bruno sulak

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by bruno sulak on Thu Oct 30, 2014 4:57 pm

tacno ali je audn drzao tolkina za vrhunsku knjizevnost.


_____
The law provides us structure to guide us through paralyzing and trying times. But it requires us a vision to its procedures and higher purposes. Before we assume our respective roles in this enduring drama just let me say that when these frail shadows we inhabit now have quit the stage we'll meet and raise a glass again together in Valhalla.
bruno sulak

Posts : 22117
Join date : 2014-10-27

Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by bruno sulak on Thu Oct 30, 2014 5:00 pm

mislim ovo za prapostojbinu sam napisao zato sto gotovo da ne znam nekoga ko voli da cita a da u jednom trenutku neznog doba nije citao musketire.

btw, zelig je poceo svoje neobicne transformacije tako sto ga je bilo sramota da prizna da nije citao mobi dika.
otto katz

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by otto katz on Thu Oct 30, 2014 5:10 pm

Obožavam dobru trešinu, ali baš trešinu, nikakvu sivu zonu, nego baš smeće. Ima jedna fantastična švalerska biografija J. B. Tita koju moram iskopati. Ne sjećam se jesam li je pročitao do kraja. JBT neradnik, vulgarni hedonist, ženskaroš, njegova putovanja po prijeratnoj Evropi. Napisano nevješto, ali s dubokom mržnjom prema glavnom junaku, onako baš od srca.
Prije, dok sam još čitao tiskovine, volio sam novinske feljtone o skrivenoj istoriji, teorijama zavjere i zabranjenim svjedočanstvima. Ono vrijeme rane demokratizacije prije i za vrijeme propasti nenarodnog SFRJ režima je bilo zlatno doba najtrulije feljtonistike, prožete autentičnom strašću za uspostavljanjem nove, polupismene, nedoučene, ali tim veličanstvenije nacionalne istine o našim narodima i narodnostima. To sam gutao na metre.


_____
Разгромили атаманов
Разогнали воевод
bruno sulak

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by bruno sulak on Thu Oct 30, 2014 5:16 pm

joj otto to je za poseban topik. nesto tipa tragom feljtona.


_____
The law provides us structure to guide us through paralyzing and trying times. But it requires us a vision to its procedures and higher purposes. Before we assume our respective roles in this enduring drama just let me say that when these frail shadows we inhabit now have quit the stage we'll meet and raise a glass again together in Valhalla.
William Murderface

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Join date : 2012-06-10

Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by William Murderface on Thu Oct 30, 2014 5:35 pm

To je sve super, druže Otto, ali to nije niska književnost, nego rekao bih, nikakva književnost uopšte. To je što reče - feljtonistika. Dobro, ova romansiran biografija verovatno može da se provuče kao nekakva književnost, ali ne bi nikad bio u iskušenju da svoje uživanje u njoj pobrkaš sa onim u pravoj(tm) književnosti.

Ja mislim pre svega na uživanje u žanrovskoj literaturi (očigledno, ne bilo kojoj, Kim je u pravu).

Evo da stavim karte na sto, do pre par godina rekao bih da je podela na visoku i nisku književnost stvar prošlost, da kako su drugovi Markes i Borkes pokazali, sve može da bude vrhunska književnost. Porstmoderna, drn-zvrc.

Trebalo je valjda da se susretnem sa realnim sopstvene želje pa da se malo trgnem. Naime, u Srbiji se sad događa brutalna, ali zaista brutalna komerijalizacija izdavaštva u kojoj između romansiranih biografija Tita i Draže, kuvara i prevodne literature (ču literature, Koelja), opstaju još jedino čik lit koji pišu voditeljke/starlete i analogna vrsta kiča za dečake koji predstavlja mešavinu epske fantastike, kvazi-istorijske fikcije, horora i stripovske estetike. Ono što je prilično strašno jeste šta ova mešavina sada polaže prava na ozbiljnu književnu vrednost, pišu se pohvale, kritike, dobijaju nagrade, u društvu u kojem nikakva intelektualna javnost vredna tog imena više i ne postoji, everything goes. To se pravda, u meri u kojoj uopšte ima potrebe da se pravda, upravo na ovaj način - nema više razlike između visokog i niskog, itd.

Tu me negde dotakao i ovaj Parksov tekst, posebno sa onim delom o njegovim studentima:

When I speak to my students, what is most striking is that the majority of them, who are content on a diet made up exclusively of genre fiction, simply do not perceive any difference in kind between these and literary works; they do not see the essentially conservative nature of the one and the exploratory nature of the other. They register no need to widen their reading experiences. Often they propose theses on genre works of no distinction whatsoever, unable to understand why their teachers might put these in a different category from, say, Doris Lessing or D.H. Lawrence.

Evo, ne kao argumenta, nego opet kao daljeg podsticaja za razgovor i novog teksta Dejana Ilića iz Peščanika:

http://pescanik.net/jednoobrazno-isticanje-razlicitosti/



_____
"Oni kroz mene gledaju u vas! Oni kroz njega gledaju u vas! Oni kroz vas gledaju u mene... i u sve nas."

Dragoslav Bokan, Novi putevi oftalmologije
William Murderface

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by William Murderface on Thu Oct 30, 2014 5:36 pm

timur chevket wrote:joj otto to je za poseban topik. nesto tipa tragom feljtona.

Apslutno. U stvari idem sad da otvorim taj topik na medijima :)


_____
"Oni kroz mene gledaju u vas! Oni kroz njega gledaju u vas! Oni kroz vas gledaju u mene... i u sve nas."

Dragoslav Bokan, Novi putevi oftalmologije
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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by Guest on Thu Oct 30, 2014 5:44 pm

William Murderface wrote:

Trebalo je valjda da se susretnem sa realnim sopstvene želje pa da se malo trgnem. Naime, u Srbiji se sad događa brutalna, ali zaista brutalna komerijalizacija izdavaštva u kojoj između romansiranih biografija Tita i Draže, kuvara i prevodne literature (ču literature, Koelja), opstaju još jedino čik lit koji pišu voditeljke/starlete i analogna vrsta kiča za dečake koji predstavlja mešavinu epske fantastike, kvazi-istorijske fikcije, horora i stripovske estetike. Ono što je prilično strašno jeste šta ova mešavina sada polaže prava na ozbiljnu književnu vrednost, pišu se pohvale, kritike, dobijaju nagrade, u društvu u kojem nikakva intelektualna javnost vredna tog imena više i ne postoji, everything goes. To se pravda, u meri u kojoj uopšte ima potrebe da se pravda, upravo na ovaj način - nema više razlike između visokog i niskog, itd.


dodao bih i da se kvalitetna knjizevnost koja dolazi spolja, bila nova ili starija, ruinira odvratnim prevodjenjem i lektorisanjem kojim se sad bavi kogod stigne. uz sve sto si naveo, knjizevni jezik ce nam uskoro biti mesavina brate bre dakle znaci bre brate draga moja mwah i marine tucakovic, tj vozicemo se ludo (sto bi englezaneri rekli u drive me crazy)
William Murderface

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by William Murderface on Thu Oct 30, 2014 5:48 pm

Apsolutno, da. A to ne važi ni samo za književnost, nego praktično za sve u prevodu - filozofiju, beletristiku, publicitsiku. Mislim da rade sa nekim brutalnim dedlajnovima, a pritom daju nekim klincima, studentim i inima da prevode za male pare, i onda ispadne tako nešto. A to je strašna stvar, jer potpuno upropasti projekat, posle niko neće da se upušta u novo prevođenje nečega što je već prevedeno.


_____
"Oni kroz mene gledaju u vas! Oni kroz njega gledaju u vas! Oni kroz vas gledaju u mene... i u sve nas."

Dragoslav Bokan, Novi putevi oftalmologije
fikret selimbašić

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by fikret selimbašić on Thu Oct 30, 2014 6:04 pm

Ni novinski tekstovi, čak ni naslovi, nisu pošteđeni skrnavljenja lošim prevodom.

Da dodam plus jedan za topic o feljtonistici. Mogu da potpišem Otov post kao svoj vlastiti, osim onog dijela o Titovoj švedskoj biografiji, to je ipak egzotika(TM). Sad mi tutnji u glavi kad se sjetim šta se sve pročitalo od početka '89. pa do ljeta '92.

Treba mi malo vremena da se saberem i sjetim nečeg baš jakog iz tog vakta.


_____
Međuopštinski pustolov.
bruno sulak

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Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by bruno sulak on Fri Oct 31, 2014 11:21 am

William Murderface wrote:To je sve super, druže Otto, ali to nije niska književnost, nego rekao bih, nikakva književnost uopšte. To je što reče - feljtonistika. Dobro, ova romansiran biografija verovatno može da se provuče kao nekakva književnost, ali ne bi nikad bio u iskušenju da svoje uživanje u njoj pobrkaš sa onim u pravoj(tm) književnosti.

Ja mislim pre svega na uživanje u žanrovskoj literaturi (očigledno, ne bilo kojoj, Kim je u pravu).

Evo da stavim karte na sto, do pre par godina rekao bih da je podela na visoku i nisku književnost stvar prošlost, da kako su drugovi Markes i Borkes pokazali, sve može da bude vrhunska književnost. Porstmoderna, drn-zvrc.

Trebalo je valjda da se susretnem sa realnim sopstvene želje pa da se malo trgnem. Naime, u Srbiji se sad događa brutalna, ali zaista brutalna komerijalizacija izdavaštva u kojoj između romansiranih biografija Tita i Draže, kuvara i prevodne literature (ču literature, Koelja), opstaju još jedino čik lit koji pišu voditeljke/starlete i analogna vrsta kiča za dečake koji predstavlja mešavinu epske fantastike, kvazi-istorijske fikcije, horora i stripovske estetike. Ono što je prilično strašno jeste šta ova mešavina sada polaže prava na ozbiljnu književnu vrednost, pišu se pohvale, kritike, dobijaju nagrade, u društvu u kojem nikakva intelektualna javnost vredna tog imena više i ne postoji, everything goes. To se pravda, u meri u kojoj uopšte ima potrebe da se pravda, upravo na ovaj način - nema više razlike između visokog i niskog, itd.

Tu me negde dotakao i ovaj Parksov tekst, posebno sa onim delom o njegovim studentima:

When I speak to my students, what is most striking is that the majority of them, who are content on a diet made up exclusively of genre fiction, simply do not perceive any difference in kind between these and literary works; they do not see the essentially conservative nature of the one and the exploratory nature of the other. They register no need to widen their reading experiences. Often they propose theses on genre works of no distinction whatsoever, unable to understand why their teachers might put these in a different category from, say, Doris Lessing or D.H. Lawrence.

Evo, ne kao argumenta, nego opet kao daljeg podsticaja za razgovor i novog teksta Dejana Ilića iz Peščanika:

http://pescanik.net/jednoobrazno-isticanje-razlicitosti/


javlja mi se da si ipak hteo da napises nishka knjizevnost :D mislim, jedno je kada bloom ganja kinga (koji btw i ne pretenduje na to da je visoka knjizevnost) a drugo je kada politicki istomisljenici nishkom koontzu isporucuju nagradu za ideolosku doslednost.

William Murderface

Posts : 49622
Join date : 2012-06-10

Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by William Murderface on Fri Oct 31, 2014 11:35 am



Pa jesteda, ali kako da ti kažem, nije to baš slučajno da novi talas nacionalne (čitaj: nacionalističke) književnosti izgleda baš tako. To jest, da li danas možemo da čitamo Kinga, a da istovremeno ne pomislimo, barem krajičkom mozga, da je podstakao takve epigone.


_____
"Oni kroz mene gledaju u vas! Oni kroz njega gledaju u vas! Oni kroz vas gledaju u mene... i u sve nas."

Dragoslav Bokan, Novi putevi oftalmologije
bruno sulak

Posts : 22117
Join date : 2014-10-27

Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by bruno sulak on Fri Oct 31, 2014 11:48 am

pa dobro ali ko je kriv za kecmanovica onda? agota kristof?

ali mislim da se moze govoriti o spontanoj i nerefleksivnoj ideologizovanosti niske knjizevnosti koja onda mora da se cita samo simptomatski.

medjutim ni to ne mora biti uvek slucaj. na primer hommage pavla zelica alanu mooreu potpuno promasuje kriticku notu originalne lige izuzetnih dzentlmena vec nam nudi besmisleno patriotsko citanje zanra. dakle jedno delo niske knjizevnosti to mozda i nije (moore) ali njegov epigon je potpuno beslovesan.
William Murderface

Posts : 49622
Join date : 2012-06-10

Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by William Murderface on Fri Oct 31, 2014 11:57 am

Da, da, slažem se.


_____
"Oni kroz mene gledaju u vas! Oni kroz njega gledaju u vas! Oni kroz vas gledaju u mene... i u sve nas."

Dragoslav Bokan, Novi putevi oftalmologije
bruno sulak

Posts : 22117
Join date : 2014-10-27

Re: "Niska" književnost

Post by bruno sulak on Fri Oct 31, 2014 12:15 pm

jednostavno popularna kultura je cesto reprezentacija vladajuce ideologije i najzanimljivija je u tim stucanjima, zjapovima i saplitanjima kada gubi korak sa ideologijom na vlasti. takodje, u pojedinim delima popularne kulture moze da dodje do brilijantnih iskoraka - na primer herimanov krazy kat je cista umetnost u niskoj formi. isto tako i caplin. neki put ideoloska mimikrija misljenja moci moze da ide i sa odredjenim kvalitetom. najbolji primer za to bi bio carl barks ciji su opus secirali matelar i dorfman u kako citati paju patku. ali i kod barksa su najzanimljiviji ti dramski tipovi i cinjenica da je tacka identifikacije patak neradnik hronicno bez posla.

kod nas je situacija takva da se dominantnom anti-intelektualizmu pridruzilo i spontani nacionalizam etno-cetno-nedic tipa u razlicitim delima popularne kulture i da je to ideolosko prepoznavanje ono sto im donosi status 'prihvacenosti' a ne sam zanr.


_____
The law provides us structure to guide us through paralyzing and trying times. But it requires us a vision to its procedures and higher purposes. Before we assume our respective roles in this enduring drama just let me say that when these frail shadows we inhabit now have quit the stage we'll meet and raise a glass again together in Valhalla.

Re: "Niska" književnost

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